Clutchless Shifiting

[trailblazer87]

i was wondering about the down too, seems like it might be harder on the tranny

I tried the upshifting today and it worked but it wa weird the way the bike jumped on each shift, even with letting off the gas a little

a little OT but someone was talking about another technique of letting off with the hand opposite the turn and i tried that too, pretty amazing

It is much more difficult, but doable. The best way I have found is to lightly put my toe on the shift lever and back off the throttle so the bike is decelerating a bit, then blip the throttle with a healthy flick of the wrist. If done right theshift lever will click down and the bike will continue to decelerate at a bit of a quicker pace. If done right you will be able to down shift at hgher revs without upseting the rear tire like you can using the clutch.:thumbup:

 

[DefyInertia]

Seemless and dead smooth DI.

+1 CVT smooth.

 

[HavBlue]

+1 CVT smooth.

Amen to that and like a Timex watch it just keeps ticking....

 

[jhall_1983]

I have been clutchless up shifting on my FZ6N for some time now but i was reading the manual last night and it says never to shift up or down without the clutch does anyone know if this is a real problem to do?

 

[Boneman]

No, it's not a problem.

Just reading this thread should have told you that...... If it was a problem, no one would be doing it nor would there be countless articles written about how to do it....

 

[trailblazer87]

No, it's not a problem.

Just reading this thread should have told you that...... If it was a problem, no one would be doing it nor would there be countless articles written about how to do it....

Right, there would be countless threads about worn out clutches and grenaded transmissions:thumbup:

 

[CHEMIKER]

I have been clutchless up and downshifting for a little while and it's sooooo nice. I started out with upshifting and got a lot of jumping. That turned out to be a timing issue. I finally got the timing right with the slight roll off throttle and the simultaneous flick up of the shifter. Then I moved onto downshifting with a similar learning curve.

Actually Hellgate and Trailblazer had the advice that worked best for me. I put slight pressure on the shifter and then blip off throttle to upshift or blip on throttle for a downshift. Makes for some fast and schmoooooove shifting when you get it right.

Now the question I have is whether anyone has direct experience or can point me to hard evidence that 1 => 2 clutchless shift is bad? I didn't know that it was a bad idea and started to shift 1 => 2 without a clutch too. It is always smooth as silk and I don't hear any strange noises. I understand the theory behind whether it's bad but have a hard time with that as I do not feel or hear anything alarming. Is it always going to ruin your tranny or just when done wrong?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Avalon786]

So is that how those guys do wheelies and shift gears, no clutch? lol. I never heard about shifting up without clutch, maybe it would help because when i'm giving it full throttle i find that when i'm shifting up it takes the rpms like a second to catch up, probably due to the fact i'm using clutch?

 

[Doorag]

I have been clutchless up and downshifting for a little while and it's sooooo nice. I started out with upshifting and got a lot of jumping. That turned out to be a timing issue. I finally got the timing right with the slight roll off throttle and the simultaneous flick up of the shifter. Then I moved onto downshifting with a similar learning curve.

Actually Hellgate and Trailblazer had the advice that worked best for me. I put slight pressure on the shifter and then blip off throttle to upshift or blip on throttle for a downshift. Makes for some fast and schmoooooove shifting when you get it right.

Now the question I have is whether anyone has direct experience or can point me to hard evidence that 1 => 2 clutchless shift is bad? I didn't know that it was a bad idea and started to shift 1 => 2 without a clutch too. It is always smooth as silk and I don't hear any strange noises. I understand the theory behind whether it's bad but have a hard time with that as I do not feel or hear anything alarming. Is it always going to ruin your tranny or just when done wrong?

Thanks in advance.

I don't do 1->2 clutchless. It seems really clunky and never smooth. Probably because it has to go 'through' neutral on the way.

 

[bluenova]

I have been clutchless up and downshifting for a little while and it's sooooo nice. I started out with upshifting and got a lot of jumping. That turned out to be a timing issue. I finally got the timing right with the slight roll off throttle and the simultaneous flick up of the shifter. Then I moved onto downshifting with a similar learning curve.

Actually Hellgate and Trailblazer had the advice that worked best for me. I put slight pressure on the shifter and then blip off throttle to upshift or blip on throttle for a downshift. Makes for some fast and schmoooooove shifting when you get it right.

Now the question I have is whether anyone has direct experience or can point me to hard evidence that 1 => 2 clutchless shift is bad? I didn't know that it was a bad idea and started to shift 1 => 2 without a clutch too. It is always smooth as silk and I don't hear any strange noises. I understand the theory behind whether it's bad but have a hard time with that as I do not feel or hear anything alarming. Is it always going to ruin your tranny or just when done wrong?

Thanks in advance.

Don't you find that when you pre-load the gear shifter in 1st that you end up in neutral before doing the throttle blip?

 

[CHEMIKER]

Don't you find that when you pre-load the gear shifter in 1st that you end up in neutral before doing the throttle blip?

That's never happened to me. The shift from first to second is just like all the other shifts, smooth and instantaneous. Is that why it's not recommended, because of the possibility of going into neutral? I can imagine that if you got into neutral instead of second that might cause some problems, especially if you didn't pull in the clutch at that point.

The reason that I ask is that I'm not an expert and am interested to learn all I can. I haven't been clutchless shifting very long. Upshifting maybe 1500 miles total and only well for 750 miles. Downshifting has been even fewer miles. I did forget to mention that I don't downshift into first. I always shift into first with the clutch when I'm almost stopped.

 

[damnpoor]

I like to upshift during the roll-off and downshift during the roll-on. In other words, to upshift I preload the lever, then let of the gas a bit. To downshift, I let off the gas all the way, preload the lever, then slowly increase throttle until it clicks. That way I'm not left with a harsh jerk from the increased RPM just before a corner. I'm already rolling on the gas to keep my speed and RPM more stable.

 

[Avalon786]

I recently tried clutchless shifting once i'm above 2nd gear, man it is really smooth if i get it at the right rpms! So doing this is a little better than using clutch at higher speeds?

 

[D-Mac]

Tried my first clutchless shifts this morning. WOW is all I can say. Smooooth. I'm new to the FZ6 and the only complaint I've had (until now) was jerky upshifts.

It will take me a while to get used to this though. I'm going to work on shifting up from 2nd on for now, but I'm sold on the concept. When folks say they are 'pre-loading' the shifter, do you mean you just push up on your foot first (holding it up) and then blip off the throttle so that the gear can engage? Is holding your foot against the pedal like that ok? I realize it should be near simultaneous with the throttle blip, but 'preloading' seems like it would be easier to learn with to start....(Edit: I think I've figured this out....'Search' is a wonderful thing....I'm such a noob).

 

[Boneman]

Tried my first clutchless shifts this morning. WOW is all I can say. Smooooth. I'm new to the FZ6 and the only complaint I've had (until now) was jerky upshifts.

It will take me a while to get used to this though. I'm going to work on shifting up from 2nd on for now, but I'm sold on the concept. When folks say they are 'pre-loading' the shifter, do you mean you just push up on your foot first (holding it up) and then blip off the throttle so that the gear can engage? Is holding your foot against the pedal like that ok? I realize it should be near simultaneous with the throttle blip, but 'preloading' seems like it would be easier to learn with to start....(Edit: I think I've figured this out....'Search' is a wonderful thing....I'm such a noob).

Pre-loading simply means applying some preasure to the shifter with your toe. Around half the amount you would do if you were going to shift. Just stick your toe under the shifter, lift up so you can feel the shifter and quickley ease of the throttle about a 1/4" twist (reverse blip). It should 'snick' right into gear with out you having to give any further input to the shifter.

 

[Boneman]

I recently tried clutchless shifting once i'm above 2nd gear, man it is really smooth if i get it at the right rpms! So doing this is a little better than using clutch at higher speeds?

Better is a realtive term. Some prefer it more than others. I find it handy when doing banking turns at highway speed and you want to shift. I don't have to worry about opening my grip to grab the clutch. I just hang on and BAM, next gear.

 

[Cuba]

I've been going clutchless on the 6 since I got it and I have to agree with CHEMIKER here. 1st to 2nd isn't a problem if you are used to it. The feel is a bit different but you can become very smooth with it, no clunking or weird noises. I preload it a bit harder and make sure I do a full upshift form 1st to 2nd, for the other gears you barely have to do anything to get it to go. You DON'T have to be going fast, you just need to be accelerating:

1. torque load on (enough throttle to be accelerating)
2. preload shifter (put moderate upward pressure on shifter)
3. very quick release and reapplication of torque load (down/up right hand flick)

It's smooth to the point that I do it with my left hand on my thigh (I do a Captain Morgan pose sometimes to cool down), although this is very highly unrecommended. The amount of throttle needed for loading/unloading gets smaller as you get better at it, like learning to drive stick you will get much smoother very quickly when you get the feel for it.

 

[Boneman]

It's smooth to the point that I do it with my left hand on my thigh (I do a Captain Morgan pose sometimes to cool down), although this is very highly unrecommended.

LOL!! A Captain Morgan...that's awesome.

"Got A Little Clutchless Shifting In Ya?"

 

[sideshow_downs]

"got A Little Clutchless Shifting In Ya?"

Thats Great !!

 

[Cuba]

Arrrr tiz true! Try it, you'll like it. Nothing like airflow to the crotch on a hot day, also it makes a weird noise, let's you know it's working :thumbup: