cdi dead in yamaha fz6 fazer S2 (europe model)

DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
Hi everyone. I have read all post that i found actually but still in dude if could fit american parts
( ENGINE CONTROL UNIT ASSY X 4S88 U49 + MAIN SWITCH STEERING LOCK 5VX-82501-11-00 )


The price of the necesary part in europe ( 4s8 8591 a 0000 and inmovilizer & main switch with red key and two black keys )
is more than double of american parts.

I have checked with two different ignition coil and always bike fail when riding in highway for a while, never inside city.

In first time, error 34 was after a while but soon display permanent when i turn on with the key.

Buyed another cdi & main switch & keys from a outtake crash bike, changed in yamaha local co but in the second ride extracity i´m with the problem again,
and appears error 34 when execute diag on display events. (dial 62: 1error / dial 61:error34)

This is my summary for six months and houndred of money wasted in replacement parts & yamaha repair workshop.


Now, still finally screwed never going to buy used parts again and would like to find accuracy info about if could fix with parts that boats.net are selling.


Anyone could help me with this ??

Will appreciate your comments about.


Thks in advance
 

Z3R0_zhift

New Member
I checked the manual and like you said it's faulty ignition #02 #03.

Have you tried unplug the ecu or battery from the bike and replug it again? For S2 ABS versions from my understanding you have to get a brand new ECU to refresh the whole bike system. I lost my keys before and didn't had spare. Tried on 2nd hand parts to start the bike and it couldn't. Thus, have to change a new ecu but the start lock+tank lock+seat lock+keys are second hand. Any Yamaha around the area to diagnose your prob with?

From what I check on the ignition coils, shouldn't it be the ones that fire the sparkplugs? Didn't try to change the sparkplugs or the ignition coils #2 & #3?
 
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DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
:thumbup: thks for your kindly reply !


Yes to all. First of all i changed all sparks , filter and change ignition coils , one for the other. Check with a voltimeter in ohms (ohmios) and was a little low, but right in parameters, anyway at first time, was confussed thinking no ignition for #2 / #3 could happens when ignition coils get harder temperature in highway, so i replace both.

I unplug ecu , watch all pins seems to be ok, tested all wires with voltimeter and has right continous parameters.
checked () fuel pressure, pick up sensor, direct plugs of ignition coils (continous & voltage) , ecu plug. (think about you in six months broke bike and sleeping with a tool in your hand......lol)


I live near of one of five better yamaha repair in Spain......... for first time after replaced first ecu and still fuc**g thirty four error.......they just said...... what you wanna we do ? ( sigh )
almost have a bill where they amount eighty dollars for check cylinders pressure and valves rank, and its awesome that you could ckeck that without open crankcase top ? (inglorious bastards)

Never before let nobody touch my bike for service......and never more !


So.......my only option before spend 1.200us.dollars that is the cost of complete ecu and main locks & keys is to found info about if any us model fits.

I have readed in this forum that us. ecus has not same plugs..........??


Another question : why are used cdi/ecu in second hand webs assuming that they only work with "married" main switch ?
 

DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
[machine] to diagnose your prob with?
Yes. this was strange for me to listen that do not have any machine for testing purposes.....only my display......that was best ya !
 

Z3R0_zhift

New Member
I have readed in this forum that us. ecus has not same plugs..........??


Another question : why are used cdi/ecu in second hand webs assuming that they only work with "married" main switch ?
Correct me if I'm wrong anyone but I don't think there's an ABS version of S2 in the US. The reason why I had to change the ECU for my S2 is due to the ABS system. Compared to those non-ABS bikes, they could use 2nd hand items whereas for those S2/ABS versions, it cannot be done and have to change to a new ECU(that has ABS). It will also reprogram the chip in the key once and recognises the encryption in it for life.

My guess is your ecu might be faulty or wiring fault. One way you can try to check whether your ignition coils are faulty:

1) Pull out 1 ignition coil out
2) Put in the sparkplug in the coil
3) Hold the ignition coil near your engine chassis with the tip of the sparkplug (hand covered in cloth just to protect from electric shock)
4) Turn the main key on and crank the bike (A few times)
5) See whether the sparkplug let out sparks on the engine chassis. If it does, it's not the ignition plugs that are faulty.

I advise if you are unsure of what you are doing. Just leave it to the professionals ok, go around asking people or mechs whether they encounter these probs. Just sharing my experience.
 
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DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
Sure that they are working. I tested both with an oscilloscope and bike works perfectly until it stop (while driving in a highway for a while) Then I wait for a few and when i try again back to work.

That's why i think is toasted' cause it's too hot (hot damm if i touch with my finger) also i . Think no one else to test.
 

TownsendsFJR1300

2007 FZ6
Site Supporter
No problem. They should be able to let you know if its good or not and help narrow down your issue.

I would definitely mention it acts up when warm/hot.

I had an ignition coil on a gas powered hedge trimmer that would break up and loose spark once it got hot...

Please post back what you find..

Scott
 

DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
Yes ! Totally agree with that. that´s why i changed both ignition coils with new sparks........and totally dumb me when issue persist.

I just send and email to theese Dutch persons also wrote right now to boats.net by they could assure any usa ecu part could also fit in europe model.

Anyway waiting for any from this forum could tell me if changed succesfull with an american ecu.
 

Motogiro

Vrrroooooom!
Super Moderator
Moderator
Elite Member
Site Supporter
Thanks for the ping Scott! :) Before you do anything further. Due to the fact that it seem to be a thermally related failure Make sure the red kill switch is not overheating and reducing current flow. You might try a jumper to bypass the switch and take the bike for a ride.

Error code 33 or 34 is for the coil 1&4 or 2&3 cylinder primary coil winding failure, Power is supplied to each coil primary positive terminal from the red kill switch. The negative terminal of each coil goes to the ECU where it is operated through it's cycles to build and collapse the field. If the engine is completely dieing as apposed to loosing 2 cylinders firing while 2 cylinder remain firing there could be a problem through the kill switch that may invoke a coil failure code from the ECU. Is the failure a complete or is it just 2 of the 4 cylinders?
 
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TownsendsFJR1300

2007 FZ6
Site Supporter
Thanks for the ping Scott! :) Before you do anything further. Due to the fact that it seem to be a thermally related failure Make sure the red kill switch is not overheating and reducing current flow. You might try a jumper to bypass the switch and take the bike for a ride.

Error code 33 or 34 is for the coil 1&4 or 2&3 cylinder primary coil winding failure, Power is supplied to each coil primary positive terminal from the red kill switch. The negative terminal of each coil goes to the ECU where it is operated through it's cycles to build and collapse the field. If the engine is completely dying as apposed to loosing 2 cylinders firing while 2 cylinder remain firing there could be a problem through the kill switch that may invoke a coil failure code from the ECU. Is the failure a complete or is it just 2 of the 4 cylinders?

Yes sir Cliff!

Re the kill switch, here's a link that may help with that switch, post #14 specifically;

http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-electrical/48311-run-switch-faulty-2.html?highlight=kill+switch
 

DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
Thanks for the ping Scott! :) Before you do anything further. Due to the fact that it seem to be a thermally related failure Make sure the red kill switch is not overheating and reducing current flow. You might try a jumper to bypass the switch and take the bike for a ride.

. Is the failure a complete or is it just 2 of the 4 cylinders?
Short anwer : Yes , just 2 of four, but changing the second ignition coil, now maybe we´re talking about all engine.


Long answer :

In riding last time , i found symptoms of breathlessness fuel. Throttle down even if to turn it till end is same.......engine goes down and when push clutch it finally stops. Then i could not make run engine inmediately. But if i wait for a few minutes, newly engine run normally.


Before change ignition coil for cylinder #2 - #3 i found several times that motor went down and stops or only stop #2#3, and when turning on again engine only with #1 - #4 running. Waiting the bike get some cold (in highway this summer was over 80-90 ºCelsius almost normal)

This last time again throttle down, engine down. wait for colder and then , runs normally.

I EDIT TO SAY I FORGOT WRITING THAT REGISTERED ECU FAIL IS AGAIN 34 (electrical loss in #2#3 plugs....)

very sorry for repeat like garlic, affraid i´m in a Led Zeppeling song :spank:
 
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FinalImpact

2 Da Street, Knobs R Gone
Super Moderator
Site Supporter
On average, how long does it take from start up to failure mode? If started cold, will it run for 15" or more or less or does it change all the time?

You have replaced the following:
Main engine ECU.
Both Ignition Coils.

If your problem occurs in say 15" from cold start, I would apply an ICE PACK to the ECU and see if it changes the timeline of WHEN it fails. Have several ready and lift the tank and swap them before they warm up. Unbolt the ECU from the tray if you need too.
WHY DO THIS? To isolate and confirm it is the ECU which is at fault. If it is the coils, wire harness, or run/stop switch, this will have no effect.


@Z3R0_zhift

Sorry, but the forum does not allow copy written material to be posted. Please remove the content from post #2.
Thanks
 

fazil

Junior Member
That red kill switch should be designed on purpose to make money of all the spare parts change. I read so many people changing every other expensive parts like ecu, coils etc just beacuse of a bad connection of that devil switch.

I also wonder if US ecu works, i have bought a spare US ecu for my bike long time ago but never tried it. They should be identical except for the immo i think.





Picture taken from an other forum:

Yamaha FZ6 - Fazer Kullan?c?lar? / Bilgi Payla??m Ba?l??? - Sayfa 382
 
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TownsendsFJR1300

2007 FZ6
Site Supporter
That red kill switch should be designed on purpose to make money of all the spare parts change. I read so many people changing every other expensive parts like ecu, coils etc just beacuse of a bad connection of that devil switch.

I also wonder if US ecu works, i have bought a spare US ecu for my bike long time ago but never tried it. They should be identical except for the immo i think.





Picture taken from an other forum:

Yamaha FZ6 - Fazer Kullan?c?lar? / Bilgi Payla??m Ba?l??? - Sayfa 382
Just as a side note to the above, you can by-pass the red kill switch without hacking up at the switch.

If you follow the two wires down, simply tying them together (Posi Taps would work great).


*I don't think its the kill switch as the engine still spins over when it fails, BUT stranger things have happened.
 

FinalImpact

2 Da Street, Knobs R Gone
Super Moderator
Site Supporter
FWIW: A little review of the various models indicates there may be an option to do some swapping. That said, the US version appears they swapped the Ignition Coil (Pins 1 & 18) and Injectors (Pins 3 & 20) basically reversing them from the rest of the bikes. Look here

Closer inspection finds a potential misprint in the manual. See ** and look at ECU pinout for those marked. No colors exist as printed. PM me if you want more details. Also which model is yours?


US models:
FZ6-SS
FZ6-SSC
FZS6W == S2 US 2007-2009 with fairing
FZS6WC == S2 US 2007-2009 with fairing (Cal)
-
FZ6-N == S1 2004-2006 Naked
FZ6-S == S1 2004-2006 with fairing
FZ6-NA == S1 2004-2006 Naked & ABS (Anti Lock System) ** Pin #6 shows no Y/W, Pin #23 no Y/R from ECU but present on Pin out. #23 in US bikes allows CO change when grounded.
FZ6-SA == S1 2004-2006 with fairing & ABS (Anti Lock System) ** Pin #6 shows no Y/W, Pin #23 no Y/R from ECU but present on Pin out. #23 in US bikes allows CO change when grounded.
FZ6-NHG(W) == S2 2007 Naked (W marks Australian version)
FZ6-SHG(W) == S2 2007 with fairing (W marks Australian version)
FZ6-NAHG == S2 2007 Naked & ABS (Anti Lock System)
FZ6-SAHG == S2 2007 with fairing & ABS (Anti Lock System)
 

DruGus

(non) ClockWorking Fazer
I´m just starting to read your kindly answers, will take some.............while do that, just to say that was reading @nders thread......... it´s terrible and seems to be similar issue......... dammned !!!

In fact, i´m just awake from last night was working on bike from 20hrs. until 05am......... was very funny starting with disarmed parts done for check all wires from start/stop engine buttom, new check ignition coils, spark check on exhaust (thks for all suggestions way to work). Red Buttom is fine, alll wires about are work and well drived, try to change ignition coils position anyway but dislike very short caps wires so i finally mount each one at his place. Well, after last bolt screwed, turn key to ignition...........what a surprise......bike runs blinkin #2#3 cylinders........stopped and before new try, display appear with 34 fail code at first turn of key...........like finally did the first ECU too............ starting to think this is not for my hands ......... disappointeeeeeeddd !!! (-)


In first , was specting to assure and in poor case for buy an oem ecu but now ......... totally lost.
 
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