Adjusting valve clearence + Throttle body sync => What do I need?

[MrMogensen]

During winter I had a bike cover on top of it + no shelves above.

As long as it's not some vital "live saving" gasket then I'll just put it in a an empty jar on the shelf. Someday I might figure out where it's from...

 

[MrMogensen]

Had a tiny little bit time today to remove the cover and measure half of the valve clearences - so far within spec :thumbup:

I am curious - is it possible to get a reading that is too tight - meaning less than the recommended clearence?

My current logic tells me that metal working against metal tend to decrease the thickness? But in the other fantastic thread (n0other's valve check) it's mentioned that "rider93" had 2 exhaust clearences that were way to tight?

Not looking forward to installing the cover again - Yamaha could have shaved just half a millimeter of the frame to make it ALOT easier

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Had a tiny little bit time today to remove the cover and measure half of the valve clearences - so far within spec :thumbup:

I am curious - is it possible to get a reading that is too tight - meaning less than the recommended clearence?

My current logic tells me that metal working against metal tend to decrease the thickness? But in the other fantastic thread (n0other's valve check) it's mentioned that "rider93" had 2 exhaust clearences that were way to tight?

Not looking forward to installing the cover again - Yamaha could have shaved just half a millimeter of the frame to make it ALOT easier

Yes, its not only possible but likely. Valves tend to tighten up over time more so than loosen. Valve seats tend to set deeper in the head with wear and tear. (heavy carbon build up or bent valves of course would open up the clearances).

Depending on how tight the valve is, on one of the FJR forums, they used glass, fine grit, wet and dry sand paper and literally sanded the shim down making it thinner. Of course a very accurate micrometer would be needed. Or just remove your shim knowing how much smaller you need, measure yours and hunt doen the correct thinner shim..

 

[FinalImpact]

During winter I had a bike cover on top of it + no shelves above.

As long as it's not some vital "live saving" gasket then I'll just put it in a an empty jar on the shelf. Someday I might figure out where it's from...

Any chance its from under the speedo/gauge where the wire connector is?

Look at these....

Any chance it fits this hole?

SEEMS TO SQUARE!!!

 

[FinalImpact]

Valves - its better to hear them with a little clatter than to have one (any) be too tight. That is lots of "tap Tap Tap sounds" is better than no sound at all. Be cautious of measuring them when its below 50F, they could all come up tight or minimum.

FWIW: I had a shop tell me to replace the head Toyota V6 as the MAX shim would not take up the clearance and it had good compression in that hole. I made my own shim. Ran the crap out of that thing and it stayed together.....

Home made shim atop lifter bucket:

Look close it can be seen here in the cutout under the OEM shim:

Final product on edge. The OEM hardened shim goes on top of it. I put it in around 140,000 miles its at > 260,XXX miles on it now.

 

[MrMogensen]

Any chance its from under the speedo/gauge where the wire connector is?

Turned out you were pretty close!
It's from the 6-pin connector to the speedo/gauge
Another of the same 6-pin can be seen comming out from the front left side of the frame along the original wiring route.

 

[FinalImpact]

Any chance its from under the speedo/gauge where the wire connector is?

Turned out you were pretty close!
It's from the 6-pin connector to the speedo/gauge
Another of the same 6-pin can be seen comming out from the front left side of the frame along the original wiring route.

So, those two connectors in the fairing???

This???

 

[MrMogensen]

Another question...

When checking the valve clearence... cam lobes should be facing away from eachother (turning the crankshaft at certain degrees according to factory service manual + n0other's great write up...

If looking at the engine as if it was tiltet so camshafts are at same height:
Should the cam lobes be pointing exactly opposite at the points where the T-mark has to be? Or would they be pointing in opposite direction and slightly upwards?
Seems like my cam lobes are slightly upwards for every cylinder at the various T-marks? Do I have a problem here?... Last cylinder check was done by a shop 4-5 years ago.

 

[FinalImpact]

Take a look at this:

What you need to keep track of this:

The camshaft has a base circle that is round. Once the round extends and blends into the RAMP or cam lobe, the RAMP CAN NOT BE USED FOR MEASURING! Only the base circle of the camshaft.

So, if the lobe or RAMP'ed section is AWAY from the lifter bucket, its free game to make a measurement. The base circle is uniform in reference to its clearance between it and the bucket/shim assembly.

EDIT: Add Pic of lobe profile. Notice the lower section (roughly covering 180°) is a safe area to measure valve lash clearance.
Do NOT make measurements in the upper region ~180° w/lobe.

 

[MrMogensen]

FINALIMPACT:

6 pin...
I have the "older" FZ6 with digital dash but could be the 6-pin connecter is the same. On my older silver frame FZ6 the dash is stuck to the frame and not the fairing so there is a similar 6-pin right behind the dash.

Cam lobes...
Sorry if my question was kind of confusing :spank:
What I meant was not at what point it was safe to measure, but more if the timing between my crankshaft and camshafts was f***ed
As in if the cam lobes (lobe lift) had to be EXACTLY in opposite direction or just opposite and a little upwards in each direction?

 

[FinalImpact]

FINALIMPACT:
- - - -

Cam lobes...
Sorry if my question was kind of confusing :spank:
What I meant was not at what point it was safe to measure, but more if the timing between my crankshaft and camshafts was f***ed
As in if the cam lobes (lobe lift) had to be EXACTLY in opposite direction or just opposite and a little upwards in each direction?

If it runs - its fine and not likely F'd up (cam/crank relationship).
Thus, rotate it Clockwise in the steps mentioned in the FSM or n0thers post, and you should be fine.

You don't need a degree wheel, just a basic line of sight that the lobes are not beyond the base circle and into the lift area of the lobe(s). Meaning, they may not be perfectly opposite or in a V angle and thats OK.

For the sake of comparing values later in life, it would be good to take measurements based upon degrees of rotation so if the values are checked again at a later date, they provide the same results so you can tell if something changed.

ALSO - DO NOT turn it backwards (CCW) if you missed a mark. Just go on to the next one.

 

[MrMogensen]

If it runs - its fine and not likely F'd up (cam/crank relationship).
Thus, rotate it Clockwise in the steps mentioned in the FSM or n0thers post, and you should be fine.................

Thank you! :thumbup:

Seems like I am within spec on all 4 cylinders. About half of them are pretty close to the low end specification but I have decided to do the check in 2 years from now (instead of 4) and just go on with what I got.

Timing chain tensioner however is another mystery for me. I am using the testing technique mentioned in the Service Manual (page 5-14). When removing the screwdriver (and thereby releasing the tensioner rod)... what is "smooth" as it should be.
While slowly releasing the chain tensioner rod (using my thumb) it might be popping back out out in smaller faster movement - is that consideres rough movemt?
If I release it freely it hammers out in a splitsecond...

The cost for this little part is around 230 USD at the local Yamaha shop so if it alright I'd rather not pay out!

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Thank you! :thumbup:

Seems like I am within spec on all 4 cylinders. About half of them are pretty close to the low end specification but I have decided to do the check in 2 years from now (instead of 4) and just go on with what I got.

Timing chain tensioner however is another mystery for me. I am using the testing technique mentioned in the Service Manual (page 5-14). When removing the screwdriver (and thereby releasing the tensioner rod)... what is "smooth" as it should be.
While slowly releasing the chain tensioner rod (using my thumb) it might be popping back out out in smaller faster movement - is that consideres rough movemt?
If I release it freely it hammers out in a splitsecond...

The cost for this little part is around 230 USD at the local Yamaha shop so if it alright I'd rather not pay out!

Try putting a little oil down the unit and get the threads oiled. Its not an oiled unit (doesn't need to be as the CCT extends a click at a time) but of course, oiling / cleaning the nternal threads won't hurt and can only smooth things out.
I would do this a couple of times and let the excess drain (and if there's any crap in there, you'll know)

Re the "rough" movement, I would slowly let it extend and again, just feel does it extend out smoothly, or rough (worn, dirty threads-internals).


Just out of curiosity, if you simply place the CCT in the block extended, how far out is the block surface to the CCT? I ask in that if the chain/guides are worn, the CCT will be closer to the block.


The below pic's are of my old KLR with a new cam chain and rear CCT guide. Prior to the new chain and rear CCT guide, that same space was maybe 1/8" (some chain rattle-28,000 street miles). With the new parts, you can see how much farther out the extended CCT sticks out from the block.

 

[MrMogensen]

Try putting a little oil down the unit and get the threads oiled. Its not an oiled unit (doesn't need to be as the CCT extends a click at a time) but of course, oiling / cleaning the nternal threads won't hurt and can only smooth things out......

While doing your recommended test I can see that there would be a full inch of further extension if I had normally installed the Timing Chain Tensioner (or CCT as you wrote = Camshaft Chain Tensioner?).
That's more than half of the full extension it is capable of = It can't be that bad.

This has only confirmed that I shouldn't spend any money right now :thumbup:

Will update again when I (hopefully) have completed with a Throttle Body Sync + Final Impact's spark plug cap check. You guys must be fed up with questions for now :spank:

Ohh one more question... would it make sense to check (and maybe repair the spark plug caps) BEFORE firing up the engine to do the Throttle Body Sync? I'd have to do another Throttle Body Sync after the spark plug caps anyways... right?

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

While doing your recommended test I can see that there would be a full inch of further extension if I had normally installed the Timing Chain Tensioner (or CCT as you wrote = Camshaft Chain Tensioner?).
That's more than half of the full extension it is capable of = It can't be that bad.

This has only confirmed that I shouldn't spend any money right now :thumbup:

Will update again when I (hopefully) have completed with a Throttle Body Sync + Final Impact's spark plug cap check. You guys must be fed up with questions for now :spank:

Ohh one more question... would it make sense to check (and maybe repair the spark plug caps) BEFORE firing up the engine to do the Throttle Body Sync? I'd have to do another Throttle Body Sync after the spark plug caps anyways... right?

Yep, that sounds good, the distance to the block. I would check/fix if neccessary the spark plug caps while your there.

I'd do the sync after that. You know your valve settings are good, plugs tight, etc..:thumbup:


You may have already read, but when doing the sync, check them again at about 4k RPM's and adjust accordingly. You should easily get them within 10mm's (spec's) at both idle and 4k. A rev or two inbetwen to let them settle too..

BTW, when I fine tuned mine, I put a large fan in front of the radiator/header and set it on high. I have mine with 2-3 mm's across the board. Of course, your NOT supposed to touch #1 screw but adjust cylinders 2-4 to #1 cylinder. *Just as a side note, IF someone screwed with it before or you run out of adjustment with the 2-4 adjusters, open #1 up maybe an 1/8-1/4 turn. It'll give you more adjustment on the others should they bottom out (and no more adjustment). Don't worry at all about the overall vacuum /pull, just concentrate on the air screws (and don't touch the center sync screw(has a spring around it) to physically sync the two throttle bodies to each other. I had a Yamaha shop do that to my FJR (a big NO NO). I ended up setting that screw back to where the white paint lined back up and adjusting the air screws as it should have been the first time..

It doesn't take barely a turn to see movement in the sync tool..

 

[FinalImpact]

Ohh one more question... would it make sense to check (and maybe repair the spark plug caps) BEFORE firing up the engine to do the Throttle Body Sync?

Yes ^^ do this first before TB Sync!

 

[MrMogensen]

Should I really REMOVE the Air Filter Case when doing the Throttle Bodies Sync?

Makes more sense to me having the airfilter in front of the system when adjusting?

The FactoryServiceManual states that I have too - "page 3-17".

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Should I really REMOVE the Air Filter Case when doing the Throttle Bodies Sync?

Makes more sense to me having the airfilter in front of the system when adjusting?

The FactoryServiceManual states that I have too - "page 3-17".

Just looked there, if you read down just a little bit more, they have you hook up the hoses, then RE-INSTALL the air filter and box..

*That was really odd, you had me going for a sec...

You should be able to reach the vacuum hoses (you'll be hooking up to) without pulling the filter box. One line on each side has a pink stripe. They'll have a black, long plastic plug in the end of each hose.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

The two PINK stripped lines should go to cylinders #1 and #4 (both outside cylinders)

 

[MrMogensen]

:bow: Special thanks to everyone who helped me out in this thread... :Sport:

Bike is running just great.
(Just posted in FinalImpact's spark cap thread aswell).

I don't hear that annoying right side rattle when dropping down from mid/high range RPM so I am pretty sure that exercising/cleaning the chain tensioner was one big winner.

TO EVERYONE WHO IS ABOUT TO CHECK FOR VALVE CLEARENCE READ THIS:

When you are done rotating the crankshaft do NOT leave the wrench hanging on the end of it. After removing the chain tensioner I did just that... and guess what happened I accidently hit the wrench with my foot and heard a CLICKETICLAK... and boom... the chain was way loose without the tensioner and jumped x amount of teeth on each of the camshafts. :spank:
Had to remove and reinstall the camshafts to get everything in the right position again. Not hard work but just a complete waste of time since all was within spec to begin with and felt like a complete :squid:

Looking at this from a positive perspective (sure wasn't easy at the time I hit the wrench) maybe the off/on work with camshafts + chain + timing chain guides was part of fixing the problem with the above mentioned rattle.

Thanks again!!!

And that Carb Tuner from Morgan is highly recommended. Very suitable if your looking to share a few tools with another biker.