When to Downshift into 1st

[SovietRobot]

I usually only put it into first when I'm almost stopped and the clutch is in.

But on the rare times I do, I make sure to revmatch it so the rear tire doesn't skid. That happened to me when I first started riding and it was an asspucker moment.

 

[red06]

when im merging onto the highway at 14000 rpm

 

[Wolfman]

The thread that WONT die!!!!

 

[mattcox1987]

Love the arse end slide feels sic i always ride on the back break and gear down coming into a corner or stopping gear to where you feel confedent :rockon:

 

[romlin]

I keep it in 2nd till I know I am going 2 have 2 stop. As I know that it will pull away fine for as low as 10 mph.

 

[Sparkybean]

1st gear is for moving off. So you change to first when you know you are going to stop, either just before you stop or after you have. That should be the end of it.

 

[Bruce67]

you risk locking up the back wheel if you try this,and possibly a crash.

 

[Sparkybean]

you risk locking up the back wheel if you try this,and possibly a crash.

Try what? I hope you are not commenting on my comment.

I gave 2 scenarios, changing to 1st at 5mph or so (as you pull the clutch in, just before you stop), or after you stop, both upon the knowledge that you know you are stopping. Please explain how either scenarios would cause a locked up back wheel, or indeed an accident.

I am a driving instructor and teach road safety for a living. I don't think I am giving false information here.

 

[Sparkybean]

Well Bruce67 PM'd me with "Work it out mate, if you want to scream around in 1st gear then carry on".

Bruce you are an idiot, if you can not understand what I said and that it in fact was totally contrary to what you seem to think I said. And that still after explaining it a second time to you, you still don't get it. And you can not even reply to this thread. And you so far as i can see have contributed nothing to this forum. Well frankly you don't deserve to have an FZ6.

 

[cookies]

what is all this about the rear tire locking up? how is that even possible, when you come to a stop, push in the clutch, brake, and start to downshift, unless im missing something i don't see how and tire locking up can occure unless you just push the brake to the cement.

 

[Sparkybean]

what is all this about the rear tire locking up? how is that even possible, when you come to a stop, push in the clutch, brake, and start to downshift, unless im missing something i don't see how and tire locking up can occure unless you just push the brake to the cement.

Exactly, that's why I have been trying to get him to reply to his comment.

 

[Speedo007]

what is all this about the rear tire locking up? how is that even possible, when you come to a stop, push in the clutch, brake, and start to downshift, unless im missing something i don't see how and tire locking up can occure unless you just push the brake to the cement.

Simply because of engine braking. If you downshift too fast to 1st gear without giving some gas before (while holding clutch) to make revs match revs in the lower gear, the engine compression can lock up the rear tire until revs meet the speed at which the rear wheel is going (or should be going). So for example (not based on real rpm numbers I don't know them yet for the FZ6 I just got the bike) you're in 2nd gear at 4000rpm you pull in the clutch, downshift, give it some gas for revs to climb to 5500rpm, let go the clutch and you end up in 1st gear with proper revs. If you're going at 60mph in 2nd and downshift in 1st (not recommended) then you get the rear wheel to lock up under engine braking, cause rear wheel is turning way faster then it should at that given RPM. Same thing could happen in 2nd gear if you were high up in 4th and downshifted abruptly.

Anyways if your rear wheel ever locks up, you just pull the clutch back in, and lose some speed before releasing it again.


Thats why on some bikes they have slipper clutches, the clutch will slip a bit while engine matches rear wheel speed instead of the wheel locking up under heavy compression.

 

[Sparkybean]

Yeah but not at 5mph!

 

[ozzieboy]

It all depends where you are. In the twisties, I like to bang it back to first around 100km/h.

At the lights I like to slip back to first around 45km/h.

In both circumstances, I blip it back and let the clutch out smoothly, and it has never locked up on me. Occasionaly the rear loses traction, because it leaves to road, but it doesn't lock up.

 

[soupflakes]

I've actually been practicing heel toe braking (well the corresponding to that for a bike) and have been getting decent at it. I use my middle, ring, and pinky finger to brake, and can blip the throttle to rev match with my thumb and forefinger while still applying the brakes. Does anyone know is this a correct way to do it? Also what would that be called, thumbfinger braking? (That sounds terrible)

 

[agf]

Only accidently gone into 1st at over 20 kms once and the tail got a real wriggle for a second,. wasn't ready and it made me well aware of what happens, so try not to do it anymore
get a Healtech indicator RhadamYgg, they are dead easy to fit and while not perfect they sure help to know when you are in 6th when you look for 7th ha ha ha ha.... thank God I stopped doing that!

 

[David Thompson]

i dont engine brake if coming to a stop, only do that before a corner. If coming to a stop i pull in the clutch when rpm's get near idle speed then go down through gears with clutch in.

 

[ChevyFazer]

I love downshifting to 1st especially when it wiggles the rear!!! I don't know exactly what speed I'm going I do it by sound but I love down shifting into 1st at about 12k, coming from 2nd I guess about 8-9k but man does it sound evil doing that plus that tail wiggling....ummmmm I love it. Never done it with out rev matching though, I imagine it would be real unfriendly like doing it that way

 

[mikw73]

I do it when the bike's warm and I'm moving real slow, and once in a while around 15-20 (mph) and I need to GO. Always with the engine moving faster than the wheel unless I'm near a stop, and never when my tires are cold. Got slippy in back a few times on cold tires downshifting to 1st when moving a little too fast when I used to not follow these rules. It's fun, but not smart, and not good for the tire. But I'm a self-proclaimed boring, slow rider. Now, many years ago, on dirt, things were different.

 

[ohgood]

what is all this about the rear tire locking up? how is that even possible, when you come to a stop, push in the clutch, brake, and start to downshift, unless im missing something i don't see how and tire locking up can occure unless you just push the brake to the cement.

some folks misunderstood, that's all. if you downshift too early, and release the clutch in 1st, while still rolling, say above 20mph or so, it will cause the back end to slide/skid. engine braking is awesome on the fz6.

whatever you do, don't test the theory on a wet road, it will bite you.