Givi Engine Guard Failure

[Caladin]

I have had the Givi engine guards on my bike for about a year now. Mine is for the 04-06 year (Givi #TN354). I like having them more then the sliders as they definitely offer more protection and less chance of frame damage. While having them on I have taken the bike through some very rough places. I have been lucky enough to never have tested them out myself (although from what I have read they do perform great).

I think they look good!

Last week while on a short ride in town I noticed a HORRIBLE knocking coming from my bike at around 5k rpm (right in that buzzy spot). I actually thought something was seriously wrong with my motor. I could feel the vibration, and it was so loud, I was certain my motor was about to kick the bucket! I parked it and checked the usual things (oil, spark plugs, TB sync to look for irregularities) but everything came up normal. After my initial fretting I found that it was indeed the engine guard that was knocking!

Here are pictures of the guards. You can see they don't have a scratch on them from being down.

Right Side.

Left Side.

On the left side, at the bottom mount near the oil filter you can see a split where the bracket has cracked and split along a weld.

Very disappointing. However I still think they would fair better then frame sliders, even in its current state. With multiple mounting points they still are strong and don't move when I push/pull on them.

From what I have read this may not be that uncommon of a problem for some models of Givi bars. The Canadian distributor Importations Thibault Ltd has denied other peoples claims for warranty replacement, so I don't think I will try going that route. I plan to get these welded.

I would like to get a few tacks welded on it while still on the bike. To hold it in its unstressed position. Then remove the bars from the bike and have it completely welded the rest of the way.

Is there anything I should know about having this tacked in a few places while still on the bike? I don't know anything about welding and am a little concerned about damage to electrical systems.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I would at the very least un-hook the battery and probably disconnect the ECU.

I'd also request the welder to put his ground hook up on the crash bar itself, you should be good to go...

 

[Norbert]

Caladin!
What's up!?
Where's the epic adventure this year???!!!
I may go on the Trans Labrador Hwy in August/Sept......kinda uncertain.

 

[DefyInertia]

Hmmm

My Givi top case rack cracked around one of the welds too. I over taxed it though.

 

[Caladin]

I would at the very least un-hook the battery and probably disconnect the ECU.

I'd also request the welder to put his ground hook up on the crash bar itself, you should be good to go...

That sounds like a plan. I will do it that way. At least then most things should be OK. Maybe I should pull a few fuses as well. The next nice day I will source a welder for the job.

Caladin!
What's up!?
Where's the epic adventure this year???!!!
I may go on the Trans Labrador Hwy in August/Sept......kinda uncertain.

Hey!
It's not to likely that I will be going on any epic adventures this year. I may do a few thousand KM trip down to Washington, Oregon, California and most. Its all up in the air at the moment, and I have not really put much thought into it.

I have thought a lot about the Trans Labrador Hwy. But it's out of the question for me this year. Other priorities. If you go I look forward to reading about it. Take lots of pictures!

Hmmm

My Givi top case rack cracked around one of the welds too. I over taxed it though.

I have the Givi top case rack and V35 Side cases. I have overloaded the side cases the most. I would not be as surprised for them to crack like this. Overloaded combined with many miles of abusive pot hole filled gravel roads did their toll on other parts. But the racks and cases remain perfect. So I guess I cant complain about that. (other then the top case rack not being even close to level!)

 

[RJ2112]

I would offer Givi the chance to make it right, before you start welding things up. Who ever they farmed the work out to, did a substandard job on that weld. You should not have to fix it.

Whatever approach you take with the fix, it's going to mess up the finish on the bars. They are probably powder coated.... the heat of the arc welder/TIG/MIG set up is going to damage the finish.

If it's enamel paint , you should be able to match it without too much effort.

I'd suggest you take the bars off before you do anything to repair them.

 

[LERecords]

I had a top case fall off my bike.. I sent the office for givi NA an email and ended up sending out my broken case and mounting plate.. they sent back my case all fixed and got a phone call from the guy i originally talked to.. i didnt even send a recipt.. givi takes pride in their products and they work to make sure that were are happy with them.. if it is sub-standard work, they will be happy to know about it..

 

[FinalImpact]

Looks like the guard cracked because the bolts were used to pull it into place creating stress on the guard. Having said that, there should be NO FREE space between the guard and the mounting points OR they will stress crack!

Assuming all the holes line up, Tacking in place Highly recommended! I'd weld it right in too.

I suggest you tighten all the bolts on one side of the bike and loosen the bolts on the other. If there is a gap between the bikes mounting area and the guard, fill the gap with washers and then tighten the bracket down.

In short either their jig is off or all Yamaha's are not the same width. Because your fracture is displaced, I would loosen ALL bolts and get everything to self align, tighten one side, add spacers as needed, and tighten that side.

As said, have the welder place the ground on the guard, not on the bike, and disconnect the battery. After that you should be fine.

 

[FinalImpact]

I would offer Givi the chance to make it right, before you start welding things up. Who ever they farmed the work out to, did a substandard job on that weld. You should not have to fix it.

Whatever approach you take with the fix, it's going to mess up the finish on the bars. They are probably powder coated.... the heat of the arc welder/TIG/MIG set up is going to damage the finish.

If it's enamel paint , you should be able to match it without too much effort.

I'd suggest you take the bars off before you do anything to repair them.

But its not the Weld that broke! Its the tube. It was induced due to a poor fit whereby the guard is wider than the bike and tubing was sucked into place which stressed to a point of fracturing.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

It would nice if they would replace it, great customer service.

From the picture, it appears the original jig is off some causing undue stress on the bracket when bolted to the frame (or as stated above, Yamaha has a lot of play in their acceptable tolerances, not likely). The weld didn't crack, the pipe adjacent to the weld cracked...

With the small amount its off (not lined up), I'd remove both pieces, grind the area to be welded clean and rebolt everything up to spec's. Then tack the broken weld in place. The tab will now NOT HAVE ANY UNDUE STRESS on it (the way it should have been to start with).

Remove the assembly for the final weld as it'll be easier to get good penetration and won't splatter weld all over the bike..

Paint and re-assemble..

If powder coated, they can sand blast the old powdercoat off and re powder coat what ever color you want... Its not terribly expensive to powder coat..

Good luck.

As a side note, I would think they'd want the old part back to see if an adjustment in their jig is due....

 

[Caladin]

Update:

But its not the Weld that broke! Its the tube. It was induced due to a poor fit whereby the guard is wider than the bike and tubing was sucked into place which stressed to a point of fracturing.

When i originally mounted it I had no problems as far as space between the guard and the frame mounting points. Everything fit perfect and went together with ease, which is much better then I can say for the givi top rack.

I did have it mounted on my last trip where the bike took a SERIOUS pounding with pot holes for many hours on end. I'm betting that may have played a part in the resulting fracture.

I contact Givi and was told they were unable to help me directly as I must deal with the Canadian distributor (Importations Thibault Ltd). I was given a specific email address for a who to contact there (plus a general inquiries one). All my e-mails went unanswered. Rather disappointing to say the least. But not surprising as that seems to be what others have run into.

In the end I had the parts tacked into place while still mounted to the motorcycle. I then removed them and they were welded on the inner and outer flange. Much stronger then they originally were (not that the original is not generally good enough as is).

So its good as new (or better!).

And I should give credit to Doug at Clearbrook Hitch Ltd. for the great service and welding he did. :thumbup:

 

[Wearyeyed]

Thank you for this thread...I have had my Givi engine guards for just short of 5 months, and they broke sometime in that range in the *exact* same spot.

Not trusting OEM, have a friend welding them up...

I'll report back....

 

[Gelvatron]

Phone app is acting up sorry for double post

 

[Gelvatron]

Thank you for this thread...I have had my Givi engine guards for just short of 5 months, and they broke sometime in that range in the *exact* same spot.

Not trusting OEM, have a friend welding them up...

I'll report back....

I agree but you should contact givi and tell them that the Canadian. Company won't assist you. And you want help get the ball rolling for others that's not acceptable what this company is doing

 

[Hellgate]

Okay, I'm way late to the party, but better the guard than the frame. Seems to me you got you moneys worth.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Okay, I'm way late to the party, but better the guard than the frame. Seems to me you got you moneys worth.

I don't own any Givi products but to my understanding makes great products.. There is an obvious flaw in their jig being off some as this isn't a one time occurance. In the first case just breaking riding over bumpy roads, IT SHOULD NOT BREAK. Had it been dropped, perhaps, it would have done its job. The second one, breaking after 5 months in the same area, WTF?

Looking at the original pictures, its very obvious either Yamaha engines are machined with a LOT OF SLOP in the main engine mounting holes (not) or Givi's jig if off just enough to cause problems.

Problems do arise in new products however, it should be addressed by the manufacturer and corrected..

Getting the runaround from GIVI as (they MADE the guard) IMHO is un-acceptable and piss poor customer service.

Folks spend enough for the part, they shouldn't have to pay again, to get it fixed correctly...

8:23am, FYI, I just forwarded this entire thread to GIVI headquarters. When/if I hear anything from them, I'll post it

 

[Wearyeyed]

Well...I certainly didn't get my money's worth.

Less than 5 months, bike hasn't been down with them on...the guards are pristine sans the broken plate, quite literally in the EXACT same place.

Went to change the oil yesterday, was looking to eyeball the drain plug to see if it might be possible to leave the guard on.

The bar was resting comfortably against the drain plug, revealing a tendency to "want" to be inboard more than at the location the broken part tried to enforce.

Looking closely, the welds are minimal, not reinforced in any way at the tube/plate interface, and it is clear the way these guards are stress-tested leaves something to be desired.

It is for that reason I won't go back to GIVI for *this* (I have side and top case by GIVI and love them).

I am not their development unit tester (who pays for the privilege, apparently)...they should have this kind of stuff figured-out *before* it goes into production....

 

[Wearyeyed]

I liken it to a parachute that - for some reason - fails while it is packed.

If it can't survive merely existing, how in the heck am I supposed to have confidence it will survive under the stress of doing what it is supposed to do?

I simply don't want to take a chance it won't work as designed simply to afford them the opportunity to demonstrate good customer service.

As a matter of costs, there's too much at stake.

 

[ChevyFazer]

Well I'm extremely late to this thread but I'll add my 2cts as a metallurgist. I can't say if givi's jig is off or not but I'd be willing to bet a years salary that once welded all they did was paint them up or powder coat them when there should have been one other step before, stress relieving the brackets. If they were stress relieved chances are they would never crack or break, at least at the weld because most welds are way stronger than the material they are welded to. And without stress relieving the weld can become brittle and lead to a crack or failure.

Stress relieving FTW!!! Metallurgy FTW!!!http://www.efunda.com/processes/heat_treat/matl_modify/stress_relieving.cfm

 

[kocherha]

I am sorry to read about your awkward experience with GIVI customer service and their inability to resolve warranty issues in an acceptable amount of time.
I do not know if this is prevalent, but I am going through a rather unpleasant experience with GIVI as well. I had purchased the GIVI sidemount kit PLX360. A supporting bar bolt did not thread properly during the installation and the bolt basically seized inside the bar. A replacement part was sent within a reasonable amount of time, but it ended up being the wrong part. I am still waiting to see if I can get a replacement. Based on what the distributor explained, spare parts from GIVI are rare or take forever to get replaced. This is not what I would have expected from a “premiere” brand.