Valve Adjustments, have you had it done?

[Cloggy]

Of course, they had to say that to justify you spending the 500 Euros. Kind of silly for them to charge that much and then say everthing is good and come back in a couple of years.

That's exactly what I thought Kenny, but they first quoted me €400 and he checked out the average cost (not just picking a number off the top of his head) and later he rang back saying they had to be adjusted, I personally think there was one slightly out but they said a couple to make it sound more credible.
I must admit it runs much smoother now but that could be due to several things after the service.

 

[pointbreak]

I had dealer check valves and sync carbs at 24K. I did the rest of the service myself.

The valves were all within specs.

Valve check and carb sync cost me GBP150.00. Wish I'd done it myself now.

 

[regder]

I don't mind being the guinea pig for the forum. The valve check isn't the only thing that I've stretched out.

I currently have over 32,000 miles on my 2nd set of spark plugs. I changed my stock at 20,000 and they were still fine. But I did upgrade them to the Iridiums.

I'm in a similar boat, at 63k km and keep on putting off my valve check. Have 43k km on my NGK Iridium plugs, planning to run them up to about 60k km. Now that I think about it, my air filter has over 30k km on it, should probably order another.

 

[VEGASRIDER]

I'm in a similar boat, at 63k km and keep on putting off my valve check. Have 43k km on my NGK Iridium plugs, planning to run them up to about 60k km. Now that I think about it, my air filter has over 30k km on it, should probably order another.

Those are some impressive numbers considering the geographical area that you're from. Not really the ideal year round climate to ride in.

 

[chihuahuastud]

Just had mine done at 24k miles, every single one was tight. Shop charged $240.

 

[Goop]

Just had mine done at 24k miles, every single one was tight. Shop charged $240.

That's a bargain. I was quoted over $500 to do mine.

 

[dimos]

I'll take my risks and will try to do it my self next week (or so).

Items:
- A print out of the service manual (I have printed the photos from the Valve-adjustment section in A3)
- A filler gauge ([ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0001K9O7E]Draper 10286 Feeler Gauge Imperial: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools[/ame])
- Torque wrench set + spanner wrenches
- Moly Grease
- Compressed air to clean some parts
- Gasket,head cover (genuine yamaha)
- Timing chain guide (top side) [ part: 5BE-12241-00 ]
(do I miss something ???)


I only hope that after I measure the clearances (following step-by-step manual's instructions), I can find the same day the valve-pad(s) I may need from Yamaha... it will be a burden to close the cylinder head cover and re-open it.

 

[Morrisey]

I'll take my risks and will try to do it my self next week (or so).

Items:
- A print out of the service manual (I have printed the photos from the Valve-adjustment section in A3)
- A filler gauge (Draper 10286 Feeler Gauge Imperial: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools)
- Torque wrench set + spanner wrenches
- Moly Grease
- Compressed air to clean some parts
- Gasket,head cover (genuine yamaha)
- Timing chain guide (top side) [ part: 5BE-12241-00 ]
(do I miss something ???)


I only hope that after I measure the clearances (following step-by-step manual's instructions), I can find the same day the valve-pad(s) I may need from Yamaha... it will be a burden to close the cylinder head cover and re-open it.

Easy enough to do, you will have to order your valve pads, you will need metric gauges and not imperial.

 

[youngy]

I'll take my risks and will try to do it my self next week (or so).

Items:
- A print out of the service manual (I have printed the photos from the Valve-adjustment section in A3)
- A filler gauge (Draper 10286 Feeler Gauge Imperial: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools)
- Torque wrench set + spanner wrenches
- Moly Grease
- Compressed air to clean some parts
- Gasket,head cover (genuine yamaha)
- Timing chain guide (top side) [ part: 5BE-12241-00 ]
(do I miss something ???)


I only hope that after I measure the clearances (following step-by-step manual's instructions), I can find the same day the valve-pad(s) I may need from Yamaha... it will be a burden to close the cylinder head cover and re-open it.

A lot of dealers run a shim exchange.

 

[JAZZ-n-FZ6]

I was able to get the right size shims, but I had to go to a few dealers. Also, I personally used the same valve cover gasket and have not had a leak. The gasket was soft still so I decided to gamble to see if I needed it.

If you do have to adjust any of the valves, you will have to take off the two covers on the right (passenger side if there was one) because You will have to take off the timing chain and replace those gaskets.

 

[youngy]

Could you not hang the timing chain on a wire to stop it dropping into the tunnel? Saves removing the chain covers.

 

[JAZZ-n-FZ6]

If I remember correctly to remove the timing chain guide (which removes enough tension to remove the timing chain from the camshafts), you need to remove it from that point (at least I did).

If you are like 90%+ of the members on this forum, your valves will be in check, but if you are like me who had 6 exhaust valves out of spec then you will need to. Best of luck.

 

[TAPnTX]

Just an FYI for the shims, you can buy individual shims for about $1.50 ea. from Rockymountainatv.com. Just select an 05 R6 they are the same shims 7.48mm. No point in buying a whole kit when they may not have all the shims you need. I understand the kits only have 3 of the same shim size. When I did my Kawasaki Versys I needed 5 of the same size. So the kit would not have worked for me.

As far as doing the job myself, I would not let a dealer touch my bike. I do everything, valves, tires, suspension and just about anything that needs to be done including a total rebuild if necessary. I see it this way, I can read just as well as anyone else. And by doing this maintenance yourself you get a much better understanding of your bike.

I rebuilt the motor of an 05 YZF600r, it was a lot of fun, and I could not believe how easy it was. I had to completely tear it down to replace some tranny parts. I bought this bike for a track bike, and did several track day s on it, and sold it to a friend that is still tracking it 2 years later.

Don't forget there are numerous people on these forums that are always willing to lend a hand if need be. And a digital camera is always your friend.

Link to valve shims at Rocky Mountain ATV"
Linky



Todd

 

[DownrangeFuture]

My FZ6 sat in someone's garage I think. I bought it under 4300 miles. 4283 I think. So I haven't done it on the FZ6 yet. I did it on my katana everytime it needed it, but I just did it anually there since my speedo was broke. It still shocks me to look down and see a working speedo. It's like "Okay 5th gear about 6K RPMS... Holy chit it does say about 70."

Although, it means I only looked for 7th once. Now I know I'm sitting about 6300 in 5th and 4900 in 6th at legal freeway speeds. Adjust accordingly for realistic speeds.

 

[killernoodle]

Not always. As the valve face and valve seats wear, the tolerance between the shim and the cam decreases. If left unadjusted for too long, you can burn a valve. Honda's 3.5L V6 has been known for this too. If the shim wears, you get increased valvetrain noise. In a high revving motor, the valves take the most abuse, so I would think this is totally normal.

The valves also stretch out slowly after a while, they get tighter. Basically, the seat/face wear and valve stretch happen faster than the cam lobe/bucket wear.

We are talking about a few thousands of an inch here, it's not like you can even measure the stretch/wear without extremely precise tools.

 

[stink989]

Valves don't stretch. The seat in the head and the valve wears when the valves close up

 

[Goop]

To follow up on this, I found a new independent shop in San Diego called Ivan's Fast Bikes Ivan's Fast Bikes

I got a quote from them, it's $260 (4 hours @ 65/hr). No charge for shims if they are needed. I'm going to set it up an appointment.

 

[FinalImpact]

Valves don't stretch. The seat in the head and the valve wears when the valves close up

very true, they don't stretch much, they break!


things that change the valve clearance:
valve face where it touches the valve seat can wear (decrease clearance)
valve seat where the valve face seats can wear (decrease clearance)
top of lifter bucket can wear (increases clearance)

valve tip can wear (increase clearance) *
the cam base circle can wear (increases clearance) *
the cam bearings can wear (moves cam closer to valve tip decrease clearance) *

The cam lobe can wear but it doesn't effect the clearance we are checking.
IMO "*" these are less likely but can happen. . .

Another book I have written as I learn the ways of the Yamahauler engineers.

FWIW: at 10k RPM the cam is turning 5000 RPM. So the valves are opening and closing 5000 times per minute. I couldn't find the open valve spring pressure but lets say the open valve has 120ftlb/in of pressure and its slamming closed beating the valve seat. A small film of gas (both unburned and burned) is the primary lubricant between valve and the head. It stands to reason that some engines will see wear that moves the valve stem closer to the cam thus reducing the gap. When you have ZERO gap when hot and 10,000 RPM is when valves get burned from being open too long!

My Vote, its worth it to check the valve clearance!

Also - If you ever have the cams out, make a diagram locating all the valves. Measure the valve pads and record them on your chart. Also right down the "as left" measurement taken using your feeler gauges. Now if you ever check the valves again, you know what the clearance was and the pad thickness in each location. With this you can determine the difference between what you have and what you need if the clearance does not meet specification and order the parts quickly if found out of spec and you have a record to see if it changed since the last measurement.

Hint: toyota does a very similar setup with thier car and truck engines. Buckets and shims just like this.

 

[Goop]

The things I learn on this forum never cease to amaze me! :thumbup:

THANKS!

very true, they don't stretch much, they break!


things that change the valve clearance:
valve face where it touches the valve seat can wear (decrease clearance)
valve seat where the valve face seats can wear (decrease clearance)
top of lifter bucket can wear (increases clearance)

valve tip can wear (increase clearance) *
the cam base circle can wear (increases clearance) *
the cam bearings can wear (moves cam closer to valve tip decrease clearance) *

The cam lobe can wear but it doesn't effect the clearance we are checking.
IMO "*" these are less likely but can happen. . .

Another book I have written as I learn the ways of the Yamahauler engineers.

FWIW: at 10k RPM the cam is turning 5000 RPM. So the valves are opening and closing 5000 times per minute. I couldn't find the open valve spring pressure but lets say the open valve has 120ftlb/in of pressure and its slamming closed beating the valve seat. A small film of gas (both unburned and burned) is the primary lubricant between valve and the head. It stands to reason that some engines will see wear that moves the valve stem closer to the cam thus reducing the gap. When you have ZERO gap when hot and 10,000 RPM is when valves get burned from being open too long!

My Vote, its worth it to check the valve clearance!

Also - If you ever have the cams out, make a diagram locating all the valves. Measure the valve pads and record them on your chart. Also right down the "as left" measurement taken using your feeler gauges. Now if you ever check the valves again, you know what the clearance was and the pad thickness in each location. With this you can determine the difference between what you have and what you need if the clearance does not meet specification and order the parts quickly if found out of spec and you have a record to see if it changed since the last measurement.

Hint: toyota does a very similar setup with thier car and truck engines. Buckets and shims just like this.

 

[kyle]

Do you mean "never cease to amaze you" or are you being sarcastic about that post being useful? Tehee.

Hey, I hear Harleys don't need valve adjustments (flame on!):
How to Adjust The Valves On A Harley-Davidson Evolution Motorcycle Engine Best Synthetic Oil, Mobil, Silkolene, Shell