New Denso 0290/4 Fuel Pump?

[Mikeinho]

Hi - hope someone can help.

Bike turns over fine, but does not fire-up after dry storing during the winter. The only sign of anything different is no usual whine from fuel pump when switching ignition to 'on' position. Checked all the fuses (they are all OK), and there are no fault codes on the dials. Kill switch is in correct position... I've made that mistake before!

I can still hear the fuel pump relay switching when I key ignition to 'on', but have no way of testing if broken. In fact, I can't even seem to disconnect the relay, and don't want to force it in case I break it. Without knowing for sure, I'm guess it is the fuel pump itself, and will need replaced. Last time I had it running, the fuel pump did sound a bit weak.

I've found plenty of OEM replacement fuel pumps for sale (less than £30 new & delivered), but I'm interested in buying a genuine part. Does anyone know the part manufacturer & part number?

Also, any tips / links to pics when replacing the fuel pump would be much appreciated.

 

[FinalImpact]

Why dont you start by lifting the tank and inspecting the green connector to the fuel pump. Many have lifted the tank and pulled the wires from the pump.

If nothing is found, use two small wires and alligator clips and power the pump directly from the battery.

Red wire will be Battery +...
Report back....
There is sticky in the tech section on repairing the F/P. Its stupid expensive new and the pump is a standard component. Cheap and used widely...

Let us know...

 

[FinalImpact]

Fuel pump trouble shooting guide.......

 

[Mikeinho]

Firstly, many thanks to both posters. Very useful tips indeed.

Also, apologies for the email thread, which is completely wrong. Denso 0290/4 is (as I understand) the fuel injector x 4, not as I suggested the fuel pump... but you already knew that because you're not a dumb-ass like me. Thanks for not calling me out.

I've done some air filter and battery work before, and used the flip-up tank method. As I really wanted to get in there, I've decided to remove the tank completely. Had a hand-pump siphon, so emptied the tank using this. It'll give me a chance to clear out any debris in any case before I put everything back.

All the electrical connections were good and solid, and no visible breaks. To be honest, I wasn't expecting to find anything the matter here, as the bike has been dry-stored over winter at no less than 10C (50F). Like I mentioned, the last time it properly ran, the pump did sound a bit pensioner like.

ANyway, getting the breather hoses off the nipples was a nightmare! And if I may...

TOP TIP: if you are having difficulty disconnecting the breather hoses from the tank (feels like they are welded on), take a set of needle-nose pliers, take a medium-firm grip of the top of the hose covering the nipple, and twist clockwise until you feel it move. You should then be able to twist/pull the hose off with a strong hand. Be careful not to grip the hose too tight with the pliers, as you could split the hose of even crush the nipple... and she doesn't want that now, does she?

Hope this helps someone down the line.

 

[Mikeinho]

Why dont you start by lifting the tank and inspecting the green connector to the fuel pump. Many have lifted the tank and pulled the wires from the pump.

If nothing is found, use two small wires and alligator clips and power the pump directly from the battery.

Red wire will be Battery +...
Report back....
There is sticky in the tech section on repairing the F/P. Its stupid expensive new and the pump is a standard component. Cheap and used widely...

Let us know...

OK, so now that the tank is off the bike (and empty), am I still okay to hook up a 12V battery DIRECT to the pump. I'm worried I might fry the pump, so I'm taking advice at this stage.

I have croc clips, and a small 12V car battery (about 40AH) which is more than twice the bike's own battery rating. Good enough for the job or avoid using?

Also, I've just remembered I do in fact have a pocket digital multimeter. Only thing is, I'm a bit of a novice at using it. I can do the basics like testing for AC/DC voltage and amps, but I'm clueless at ohms testing, which is what I think I need to know to test for breaks or shorts.

As both the sender and pump power sockets have been disconnected, is there any danger in creating a fault code in the bike's memory if I hook up the multimeter to the pump power terminals while the sender is also disconnected? Am I right in saying the tip-over sensor is connected to the sender, or is it on the bike?

Any follow-up tips before I barrel on?

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

The tip over sender is under the right POD and won't come into play.


Simply hook the 12 volt battery as posted above and listen to the pump.(disconnected from the bike)

Did any crap come out of the tank to speak of?

 

[FinalImpact]

I would have left it connect to the bike and fuel rail while full of gas.

Reasons; if its the bikes harness and you power the pump and it works, now you look at the bike.

The big one is safety tho! A solid stream of fuel from a running pump is one thin. Fuel vapor from a pump (tank is empty, line is off), now we have vapor which can be lit by almost any source!

Wrap some rags around the outlet so fumes are contained and power the pump making the final connection at the BATTERY AWAY FROM THE PUMP!

 

[Mikeinho]

The tip over sender is under the right POD and won't come into play.


Simply hook the 12 volt battery as posted above and listen to the pump.(disconnected from the bike)

Did any crap come out of the tank to speak of?

Just packed up for the evening, but I'll give it a go tomorrow.

The siphon I used had a clear tube, and from what I could see the fuel coming out was clean. However, there is still a little fuel swishing about in the tank, so when I come to discard the last half cupful, I'll pour it through a coffee filter and see if there is anything in there that shouldn't be.

Will report back my findings.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

To clarify, disconnect the harness from the pump, leave all the fuel lines intact (tank tilted up)

We just want to see if the pump fires up as normal using an outside 12 volt source...

Leaving some fuel in the tank (at least 1/4) will keep the pump submerged and be much safer(little to no fire hazard).



I asked about crap in fuel as if the internal pump filter is clogged up, that would certainly cause pump issues, IE:

 

[FinalImpact]

For the record it's pretty easy to drop those hoses back into the chsssis. So, just leave them on the tank.

Last little bit; using your DC volt meter, straddle the pins of the green connector and verify it shows battery voltage. Key ON of course and kill in run position.

Be warned that the meter IMPOSES NO load. So even it it shows battery voltage, there could be one tiny little strand making a connection and your meter would show 12v but NOT run the pump.
A larger lamp like 55watt bulb would make a suitable load. An LED would be bad, an 1157 would give you warm fuzzy.

Yes - its 12v pump and you can connect it directly to the battery for a test!

 

[Mikeinho]

Great pic... I'll know what to look for now... a dirty teabag!

A little worried by the fire hazard suggestion, as I've already emptied the tank and removed from the bike.

I think to be safe I might remove the pump from the tank and test outside... and have my CO2 extinguisher on stand-by.

Will post pics if I find anything interesting.

Thanks again!

 

[Mikeinho]

For the record it's pretty easy to drop those hoses back into the chsssis. So, just leave them on the tank.

Last little bit; using your DC volt meter, straddle the pins of the green connector and verify it shows battery voltage. Key ON of course and kill in run position.

Be warned that the meter IMPOSES NO load. So even it it shows battery voltage, there could be one tiny little strand making a connection and your meter would show 12v but NOT run the pump.
A larger lamp like 55watt bulb would make a suitable load. An LED would be bad, an 1157 would give you warm fuzzy.

Yes - its 12v pump and you can connect it directly to the battery for a test!

Superb... I have a few spare 50W MR16 spotlights in a drawer, so I'll use one of these to run the load tests.

Which gauge wire for connections would you advise? It's only for a few seconds I suppose , so I imagine I'm not going to overheat anything.

 

[FinalImpact]

Correct... Just a quick test.

Just saying, be smart.

Did you take the hose from the fuel rail or off the tank?

 

[Mikeinho]

Sorry for the delay... finally got back to working on the issue today.

So, I’ve done the bulb test on the green fuel pump connector. Turned key to ON position, click from the relay and simultaneously the bulb lit up. Bulb turned off after the second click from the relay as expected. Tried this a few times just to be sure it wasn’t a fluke. All good.

Next step was to inspect the pump. Sweet home Alabama! How tricky is getting the pump out of the tank?!

NOTE: if anyone is trying this themselves (for the first time), at this point you need to find a clear imagine showing the plastic tab that needs to be manoeuvred, and in which direction in needs to go. Suggest you make sure you have a screwdriver with a bare shaft longer than 4 inches. You might find the shoulder of the driver gets caught on the outermost part of the pump, so a clear 6 inches of metal is required to get the correct angle. I didn’t have a long enough driver, and ended up using a metal kebab skewer to flick the plastic tab.

Anyway, nothing worrying inside the tank or around the pump. A little discolouration in the remnants of the fuel, but no debris bigger than a few light fibres round the filter... probably fell of my gloves when refuelling. The fuel must have been pretty old, as it didn’t have that usual powerful hit. I noticed the last couple of times I turned the engine over during the winter that the idle revs were dropping, so the octane level may have reduced over time.

There was a light glazing (orange/tan) round the pump mechanism, but really nothing dramatic; microns thick rather than full millimetres. It came off in tiny flakes when I wiped it with a dry cloth. Checked all the visible electrical contacts, and they seem good. Gave them a scratch with a screwdriver just to see if anything dislodged. The ‘teabag’ filter is discoloured too, but still flexible and breathable from what I can see.

Apologies... I didn’t have my camera-phone on me to capture the evidence. Might grab some shots before I put it back together.

Next step... just waiting on the fumes to dissipate. I’ll then hook up the pump to a 12V DC source and see if I get anything from it.

Thanks for all the tips that got me to this point.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Too late now, (ya got ahead of me) but here's your pic to split the pump into two pieces to pull it out of the tank W/O damaging it.

Push that lever in the arrow direction and the sender separates from the pump(slides away-but the wires are still connected)


BTW, installing, the pump goes back in assembled and is MUCH EASIER (piece of cake actually)

 

[Mikeinho]

Thanks... that's the very same image I found that helped me locate where I needed to be when separating the float from the rest of the pump.

Moving on, I've been doing a bit more reading. Yet to confirm it is the internal pump that is the underlying issue, but it's fairly obvious where we are heading. Worryingly, if I need to replace the pump, apparently I need to buy the whole pump assembly; the cost of which is pretty steep... about 1/4 the cost of a (running) used bike. Alternatively, I understand that the pump from an R6 can be used, but there is loss of some functions, e.g. fuel level reading.

However, can anyone confirm if the pump is serviceable or if it can be swapped out with a new pump (internal only).

If so, links to guides would be very much appreciate. Thanks.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

There have been numerous threads about pumps, aftermarket and R6 pumps here on the forum.
I haven't followed it much, either do a search or someone (Finalimpact) keeps up what'll fit, etc.

I can't confirm about the R6, but check the "for sale" section and post in the WTB section.

Used pumps come up occasionally as bikes get wrecked, parted out...
[MENTION=15974]FinalImpact[/MENTION]

Here's a pump (kind of an old thread): http://www.600riders.com/forum/bikes-parts-for-sale/56286-f-s-fuel-tank-2005-silver.html


Gotta look!!

 

[Mikeinho]

Thanks for the post. I'll try contacting F.I. as suggested.

On closer inspection, the plastics surrounding the metal pump appear to be sealed, so maybe it's a no-go.

Got a couple of pics now, so I'll try uploading later when I'm back at the PC.

Sent from my Lenovo A916 using Tapatalk

 

[Mikeinho]

 

[Mikeinho]

Also, there's good continuity along the black and blue wires right up to where it meets the internal pump, so it must be the pump itself that's kaput.

Any suggestions at this time are welcomed.