Front suspension shot?

[CHEMIKER]

How many miles on the moto?

30,000. Ironically just turned over yesterday...

 

[DefyInertia]

2 inches of sag is over 50 mm, no? That's quite a bit. Fresh oil and new springs will definitely change things for you. I bet the old oil will be GREY and nasty when it comes out (no where near as clean as your chain!!!!).

R6 forks....they are cartridge forks...OEM forks are damping rod...you can google the differences.

Sourcing and installing the R6 forks is much more of a hassle than simply dropping in new oil and/or springs. I recommend for you the best route is to simply freshen up the front end with new oil and/or springs. I wrote a thread on how to do it.

 

[CHEMIKER]

2 inches of sag is over 50 mm, no? That's quite a bit. Fresh oil and new springs will definitely change things for you. I bet the old oil will be GREY and nasty when it comes out (no where near as clean as your chain!!!!).

R6 forks....they are cartridge forks...OEM forks are damping rod...you can google the differences.

Sourcing and installing the R6 forks is much more of a hassle than simply dropping in new oil and/or springs. I recommend for you the best route is to simply freshen up the front end with new oil and/or springs. I wrote a thread on how to do it.

Yeah, just over 50mm sag. Thanks for the confirmation, I read your (awesome by the way) thread and lots of others and am pretty sure I need/want to do this mod.

Did you replace anything else, like seals/dust covers? Seems like some folks have and some haven't, and I am not sure what the answer is. I do not currently have a leak, but is it worth doing the seals while I'm in there?

 

[philosopheriam]

First question: are your forks leaking?

If not, here's my suggestion...

I installed RaceTech springs (for my body weight, use ther online tool to calculate your rate) and 15w oil in my forks and it did wonders for the handling of my bike.

After you remove your fork legs and remove the fork caps, dump out the old oil from each leg and fill each leg with kerosene - cycle the legs several times. The kerosene will gently clean the crap out of your forks without damaging your seals.

Next, dump out the kerosene and pour some oil in. Cycle the legs several times and then dump out the oil. This will remove any residual kerosene from your forks.

Next, fill the legs with oil and use a fork oil tool to set the level in each leg. Don't bother ffing with a graduated cylinder - a motion pro fork oil tool can be had for cheap online and you can set your level perfectly.

You will have to cut new proload spacers for your fork. Considering that the new springs will be shorter than your old ones, calculate how long your old spring + spacer were and then calculate your new spring + spacer at the same length. Take this distance and + or minus length on the spacer to add or subtract preload.

When you reinstall the forks in the triples, gently snug the upper triple pinch bolts first. Then, install the wheel. Then, snug the lower triple pinch bolts. Then torque all the pinch bolts to the factory spec.

There you go - fresh oil + new springs + aligned forks... Yay!

 

[Razer]

Just had this same problem after the bike sat out in the sun all day at 35 degrees C. Everything seemed fine the next morning after being in the cool garage. Guess the heat thinned it out a little....

 

[CHEMIKER]

First question: are your forks leaking?

If not, here's my suggestion...

I installed RaceTech springs (for my body weight, use ther online tool to calculate your rate) and 15w oil in my forks and it did wonders for the handling of my bike.

After you remove your fork legs and remove the fork caps, dump out the old oil from each leg and fill each leg with kerosene - cycle the legs several times. The kerosene will gently clean the crap out of your forks without damaging your seals.

Next, dump out the kerosene and pour some oil in. Cycle the legs several times and then dump out the oil. This will remove any residual kerosene from your forks.

Next, fill the legs with oil and use a fork oil tool to set the level in each leg. Don't bother ffing with a graduated cylinder - a motion pro fork oil tool can be had for cheap online and you can set your level perfectly.

You will have to cut new proload spacers for your fork. Considering that the new springs will be shorter than your old ones, calculate how long your old spring + spacer were and then calculate your new spring + spacer at the same length. Take this distance and + or minus length on the spacer to add or subtract preload.

When you reinstall the forks in the triples, gently snug the upper triple pinch bolts first. Then, install the wheel. Then, snug the lower triple pinch bolts. Then torque all the pinch bolts to the factory spec.

There you go - fresh oil + new springs + aligned forks... Yay!

Thanks so much! This, with Defy's thread will surely get me through the work.

Don't worry about me, being a chemist I have ways to measure fluids :thumbup: Seriously though, I was already thinking about the fact that some of the oil will come out on the springs and some will stick to the inside of the tubes, so even measuring what pours out will be short, right? I was thinking of using a dipstick type thing, just a metal rod that I dunk down into the fluid, then I can measure the fluid level directly, which is actually how it's specified in the manual. Having done the mod, do you think this would work?

 

[Lefty]

Order the parts Travis, and I'm on my way to lend a hand with the install..:thumbup:

 

[dxh24]

What is the advantage of doing the R6 versus just springs and oil besides adjustability and upgraded brakes? I already have the '07 with the new brakes, and not sure I really need the adjustability. I'm just starting to do research on this, so I'm open to any suggestions/info I can get.

Adjustability, if used, can turn your experience from "thinking your fast" to actually being fast... most people don't touch the suspension but if you set it up right for you, it makes turning easier, faster, and puts a bigger smile on your face....For instance, i've ridden dirtbikes set up for someone else, and no matter how long i drove it, i couldn't go any faster... then my buddy who owns it would run a 5 second quicker lap time (flat track no jumps)... having fixed suspension is fine but it only gets better if you upgrade to adjustability (again, if you use it).

When properly adjusted it will make it so the nose doesn't dive harshly, or rebound too quickly, which helps you hold stability through a corner, which gives you the ability, and confidence to go a little faster.

I expect the insides of an r6 suspenion are a little stiffer so it naturally doesn't dive as much, but may also compromise on ride comfort on rough bits.. (i'm sure those who have done the mod can comment here)...

Anyways it's up to you :thumbup:

Just my .02


Disclaimer: As per the dirtbike story i then got on my yzf (same class as his honda) and ran a 2 sec a lap quicker than his quickest so skill wasn't really the issue

 

[philosopheriam]

Thanks so much! This, with Defy's thread will surely get me through the work.

Don't worry about me, being a chemist I have ways to measure fluids :thumbup: Seriously though, I was already thinking about the fact that some of the oil will come out on the springs and some will stick to the inside of the tubes, so even measuring what pours out will be short, right? I was thinking of using a dipstick type thing, just a metal rod that I dunk down into the fluid, then I can measure the fluid level directly, which is actually how it's specified in the manual. Having done the mod, do you think this would work?

Take alook at the pic - see the collar and the rod? Once you set the collar to the correct distance, you can easily suck out the oil until it is at the correct height. This makes setting your oil level fast and accurate. Iv'e found that using rulers and graduated cylinders are nothing but a pain in the ass...

 

[YamaSpeed]

Just thought you may be interested in this. I did a front end job on an SV 650 and used the Race Tech Springs and Cartridge Emulators. The Emulators were a huge improvement over stock and they are adjustable. I Plan on putting a set in my FZ.

 

[DefyInertia]

I do not currently have a leak, but is it worth doing the seals while I'm in there?

No. I'm sure they are fine. Changing the seals can be a pain. Pulling off your forks to do this work is not very difficult.

 

[CHEMIKER]

Take alook at the pic - see the collar and the rod? Once you set the collar to the correct distance, you can easily suck out the oil until it is at the correct height. This makes setting your oil level fast and accurate. Iv'e found that using rulers and graduated cylinders are nothing but a pain in the ass...

Thanks, easy enough to make my own as I have the parts laying around.

 

[CHEMIKER]

No. I'm sure they are fine. Changing the seals can be a pain. Pulling off your forks to do this work is not very difficult.

Thanks for the confirmation. I ordered the springs and oil today. Went with 0.85kg springs, and 15W oil since that's what Racetech offers.

It looks from your how-to thread that the spacer comes with the springs, is that correct?

 

[wpgibson]

I have an order into Racetech for .95 springs and 15W oil (not yet confirmed over the phone).

I have a leak on the front right fork seal, so while I'm repairing that, I'm doing the springs too.



{Goes off to order fork seal parts from RonAyers}

 

[CHEMIKER]

I have an order into Racetech for .95 springs and 15W oil (not yet confirmed over the phone).

I have a leak on the front right fork seal, so while I'm repairing that, I'm doing the springs too.



{Goes off to order fork seal parts from RonAyers}

Cool! They're not super fast at the phone confirmation thing. I ordered over the weekend, and by noon today they still hadn't called, so I called them and was able to do the confirmation over the phone instantly. Already got the shipment notification that my springs are on the way :rockon:

 

[CHEMIKER]

Springs arrived tonight :rockon:

Can't wait to install them, probably over the weekend.

 

[RJ2112]

Springs arrived tonight :rockon:

Can't wait to install them, probably over the weekend.

Of course, this is going to point out how bad the back suspension is....:scared:

 

[CHEMIKER]

Install report: All is well! Installed the springs today, and it went just as expected, thanks to DefyInertia's thread, and philosopheriam's post from above. Can't thank you guys enough. I reduced their instructions to bullet points that I used:

- Elevate your front wheel.
- Remove the brakes, front fender and front wheel.
- Cover tank and triple with towel
- Loosen the fork caps before you loosen and remove the forks from the bike for obvious reasons
- Loosen the clamps holding the forks in place and slide them out (cut/clip the zip ties).
- Remove fork caps and pull spacers out along with the stock washer and springs.
- Dump out the oil into a container.
- Compress/extend the shocks a few times while upside down
- Add ~100mL mineral spirits to each leg, one at a time. Cycle the legs several times. The mineral spirits will gently clean the crap out of your forks without damaging your seals.
- Dump out the mineral spirits and pour some oil in. Cycle the legs several times and then dump out the oil. This will remove any residual mineral spirits from your forks
- Measure the length of your old spring + spacer.
- Cut your spacers using the RaceTech provided pipe and decide how many if any RaceTech provided washers you’re going to use.
- Fill the tubes with oil according to the service manual.
- Put the fork springs in, then the stock washer, next the RaceTech spacers you cut, any RaceTech washer(s), and finally screw on the cap most of the way.
- Slide the forks back in the clamps and tighten the top clamps just enough to keep the forks from dropping, install fender, wheel and then brakes.
- Now that the forks are tied together by the wheel and the fork clamps you can finish tightening the fork caps and set the forks exactly where you want them in the clamps.

 

[CHEMIKER]

Here are some extra install notes:

I used the bullet point list, along with pages 2-21, 4-49, and 4-43 from the 2007 service manual for torque and oil level specs.

I made a dipstick that I marked with a fill line. .

I also used a syringe with some tubing on it to remove excess oil and add a little at a time when I was getting close to the spec.

While filling, I put the fork into a 5 gallon bucket so that I could keep it upright if I needed to walk away from it mid-fill.

I noticed some corrosion (more like staining) on the fork tubes, and removed it with cleaning wax. No polish needed.

I used about 580 to 600 mL oil in each tube.

With identical unsprung length, I had 43mm sag with the original springs, and 22mm sag with the new springs. I'll be increasing my sag with the new springs, but thought it might be a handy reference to see the original compared to the new springs, given the same unsprung dimensions.

 

[RJ2112]

I'd suggest you try riding it, before you increase the sag. That part is easy enough to tweak, as you don't have to remove the fork legs from the bike. Just loosen the top clamps, unscrew the caps, fish out the spacer, and then a washer.....

Now that you have it all assemblied, you need to ensure the legs are parallel. Loosen all of the pinch bolts on the fork legs EXCEPT the lower triple clamp. (This includes fender mounts. And the axle.)

With the lower clamp as the only reference, get on the bike, grab a fist full of front brake, and romp on the handlebars to compress the fork. Do this at least a half a dozen times. [ This will allow the fork legs to find their paths of least resistance compared to each other. It will reduce stiction, and binding caused by the forks not running 'true' to each other. ]

When you are done, cinch everything down to spec.