Engine shutting down mid-flight

[teeter]

My 2006 (25K miles) has shut down on the road three times over the past week (twice today.) It acts as if I've flipped the kill switch. I've been able to start it each time while still rolling, though the last time I had to drop down to neutral and pull the clutch to get it to start again.

I'm thinking it's electrical in nature. The bike runs smooth... perfect really at all other times. I suspect side-stand or kill switch problems.

The only other clue I can provide (and I suspect it's not related) is that my start button is somewhat hosed. I ride all winter and my poor bike is never garaged. Sometime it gets wet on my ride home and in the morning it's pretty well frozen. Occasionally I have to "un-stick" the starter button by pressing on it heavily and that's obviously not good for it. Anyway, lately it stopped "clicking in" entirely. What I mean is I have to press it fairly hard to engage it and it's more like I'm bending the mechanism slightly rather than moving it on it's pivot point - if that makes any sense... The reason I don't think that's related is because that button activates the starter.. it doesn't actually dictate whether the motor runs or not.

Any thoughts? Is it a common problem? Any advice on pinpointing it?

I'm taking a trip this weekend and I hope not to have to start twisting wires together on the side of the road in hopes of short circuiting whatever safety switch may (or may not) be causing this.

Thanks!!!!!

 

[RJ2112]

The design of the kill switch on the FZ6 involves passing a live current through the switch to indicate it is closed, allowing power to the ignition system. If the contacts corrode, you get 'iffy' contact, and the bike will suddenly quit. A simple test of the switch is to 'shim' it to one side or the other of the space the rocker switch is mounted in. This will put the contact on a different part of the metallic surface it 'swipes'.

If your problem goes away..... the switch is bad.

 

[McLovin]

I had this happen before from a damaged wire in the headlight assembly. Would blow a fuse everytime i washed it too. Fixed the wire and issues gone.

 

[Motogiro]

The kill switch is my first thought on this. If you can jumper the 2 wires from the kill switch it will also tell you whether it's the contacts on the switch. With the jumper securely in place the switch is bypassed and if the bike runs okay you'll pretty much be sure that's was it.

 

[teeter]

The kill switch is my first thought on this. If you can jumper the 2 wires from the kill switch it will also tell you whether it's the contacts on the switch. With the jumper securely in place the switch is bypassed and if the bike runs okay you'll pretty much be sure that's was it.

I'm liking this thought process. I assume it's the kill switch after reading these replies. Considering its exposure to the elements this seems even more likely.

I don't have time to fix it or even fully test it before leaving Friday, so I'll pack a short length of wire and some other electrical bits. I will also shim the switch before leaving for work tomorrow. That's an especially interesting method as it requires no internal mucking around.

No matter what, the whole right side assembly needs replaced... eventually. But that's roughly $160.

 

[Caladin]

I had my engine kill switch die while on a trip. It was a simple roadside fix with a little bit of wire (don't lose the ball bearing/spring inside when taking it apart!).

I just used some wire around the terminals to bypass it. I have since cleaned the switch contacts with some fine sandpaper and it has worked happily since.

The time you had to pull the clutch in and go to neutral suggests to me that this switch may not be your problem. Neutral is not required to restart the bike when you use the kill switch.

You can test this by switching the engine kill switch while in gear at a moderate speed. When you switch it back on the bike will start itself right back up with no need to use the starter (like a push start).

Something to consider.

 

[Motogiro]

I just thought of something else. Doesn't the FZ6 shut the motor off if you have it in gear and put the side stand down? Make sure your side stand is secure as well as the side stand safety switch. Make sure the screws on the switch are tight and all is working properly in that area. It would be another source of the problem you're talking about.

 

[going going.....gone]

I just thought of something else. Doesn't the FZ6 shut the motor off if you have it in gear and put the side stand down? Make sure your side stand is secure as well as the side stand safety switch. Make sure the screws on the switch are tight and all is working properly in that area. It would be another source of the problem you're talking about.

Agreed possibly the only thing that would cause that problem. Either the switch is loose and making contact during riding or it's about to break or you have a intermittent short causing the problem.

So check the switch see if it's loose if it is tighten it also while your there clean it. make sure you check the side stand spring for slacking ect. Just to ensure it's not bouncing about and catching the switch.

If it's a intermittent short then all I can suggest is to trace the wire from the switch see if you can see any breaks or replace the whole peice.

Hope this kinda helps

Dan


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=52.967873,-0.035509

 

[ChevyFazer]

I dont want to be the black sheep but everytime I read somethi.g like this I cant help but to think of what mine did....the same thing....cause; the negative coming disconnected from the battery

Sent from my R800x using Tapatalk

 

[teeter]

Thanks again all! :thumbup:

I started my bike this morning and tried shimming the kill switch to the side. While I was moving it around the bike shut off. That was a pretty good indication that the kill switch is to blame. I will find the time tonight to get in there to see if I can clean and adjust it. I am confident it's the kill switch. I just hope that the starter button assembly doesn't fall into a hundred pieces when I open it up. The shim didn't work btw - the motor shut down 3 times in quick succession this morning.

Regarding the side stand switch... I suspect that when I dropped it in to neutral yesterday and got it to start again it was just coincidental timing. For the sake of full disclosure I should mention that I did oil the pivot point the other night and the stand does move extremly easy now. Technically, that could lead to it dropping out of position on hard bumps, but I'm pretty sure that's not what's happening.

Thanks again for all the replies! I'll check in tomorrow with an update.


(BTW - I'm not ignoring the other possibilities such as headlight wiring or loose battery cables. I'm just really leaning towards the kill switch at this time.)

 

[Marthy]

Thanks again all! :thumbup:

I started my bike this morning and tried shimming the kill switch to the side. While I was moving it around the bike shut off. That was a pretty good indication that the kill switch is to blame. I will find the time tonight to get in there to see if I can clean and adjust it. I am confident it's the kill switch. I just hope that the starter button assembly doesn't fall into a hundred pieces when I open it up. The shim didn't work btw - the motor shut down 3 times in quick succession this morning.

Regarding the side stand switch... I suspect that when I dropped it in to neutral yesterday and got it to start again it was just coincidental timing. For the sake of full disclosure I should mention that I did oil the pivot point the other night and the stand does move extremly easy now. Technically, that could lead to it dropping out of position on hard bumps, but I'm pretty sure that's not what's happening.

Thanks again for all the replies! I'll check in tomorrow with an update.


(BTW - I'm not ignoring the other possibilities such as headlight wiring or loose battery cables. I'm just really leaning towards the kill switch at this time.)

That was my first tough... When you mention it restart in neutral. By pass the kick stand switch for a quick test... maybe it is just a bit sticky. Clean her up...

If it was the kill switch it will cut on & off but will restart itself since your rolling... But check everything... Battery connection, shaved harness... electrical problem are a pain... good luck!

 

[ChevyFazer]

Thanks again all! :thumbup:

I started my bike this morning and tried shimming the kill switch to the side. While I was moving it around the bike shut off. That was a pretty good indication that the kill switch is to blame. I will find the time tonight to get in there to see if I can clean and adjust it. I am confident it's the kill switch. I just hope that the starter button assembly doesn't fall into a hundred pieces when I open it up. The shim didn't work btw - the motor shut down 3 times in quick succession this morning.

Regarding the side stand switch... I suspect that when I dropped it in to neutral yesterday and got it to start again it was just coincidental timing. For the sake of full disclosure I should mention that I did oil the pivot point the other night and the stand does move extremly easy now. Technically, that could lead to it dropping out of position on hard bumps, but I'm pretty sure that's not what's happening.

Thanks again for all the replies! I'll check in tomorrow with an update.


(BTW - I'm not ignoring the other possibilities such as headlight wiring or loose battery cables. I'm just really leaning towards the kill switch at this time.)

If that happened then it seems like you found your problem

Sent from my R800x using Tapatalk

 

[teeter]

Quick update...

I decided not to take the bike on my trip this past weekend. I didn't want to be stuck on the side of the road in Irene's rains trying to resolve this issue.

I did partially take apart the kill switch assembly in a parking lot the other day but didn't see any obvious problems. After that it didn't shut down for roughly 50 miles, but now the problem has started up again. I'm even more sure that the kill switch is the culprit now. I just have to make the the time to completely dismantle it and sand the contacts etc.

 

[Motogiro]

Quick update...

I decided not to take the bike on my trip this past weekend. I didn't want to be stuck on the side of the road in Irene's rains trying to resolve this issue.

I did partially take apart the kill switch assembly in a parking lot the other day but didn't see any obvious problems. After that it didn't shut down for roughly 50 miles, but now the problem has started up again. I'm even more sure that the kill switch is the culprit now. I just have to make the the time to completely dismantle it and sand the contacts etc.

Don't sand the contacts. Use a pencil eraser. A pencil eraser is a very mild abrasive and will generally not harm the contact's precious metal coating.

In fix you could also solder a jumper across the wires. If the bike dumps your lean angle sensor will shut the motor of anyway.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Some di-lectric grease on the contact points (once apart) should prevent further corrosion/problems...

 

[DownrangeFuture]

So, when your engine cuts off mid-flight, you'll need to begin procedures for an emegency landing. First locate a sutible spot by looking around quickly, then set your pitch for a slight nose down attitude. The exact angle will depend on your angle of attack in your aircraft. Once you're in the ideal glide angle, set the trim. Then start looking for the causes.

First is to reset all the magnetos and reprime if nessicary. Then try to fire it again, 2-3 times. You can also try watching the fuel flow meter if you have one installed to see if that is the issue. Sometimes the fuel tank valve will get stuck and you can manually turn that. You can also try to only turn on the mageneto for the engine and start it that way.

Ensure that you pass a mayday over the channel for the nearest ATC or open airport and give them the expected landing position.

The ideal glide slope for most small aircraft should have only dropped you 1000 feet or so by this point and you're still at the same KIAS. Recheck your landing site now that you're closer. Is there a better one within glide range? Power lines or other hazards you didn't see before? Update ATC if nessicary.

A straight in approach is better and since you can't gain speed, only lose it at this point, it's better to come in hot and then dump speed as you get close to landing. Remember the old saying "A good landing is one you can walk away from, a great landing is one where you can fly the plane again." Aim for a great landing, but if you come in hot and it's only a good landing, at least you're alive.

If you're landing in grass, try to touchdown softer than you would on pavement. The skinny wheels used for tarmac like to stick in soft ground, but you can land without sticking them hopefully, if you're gentle on the touchdown.

Once down, good, great, or bad landing, wait for emergency services. If you were unable to get in touch with ATC due to radio problems, call 911 on your cell. Ideally, you would have set up a flight following with ATC as soon as you were airborne on your route, and the unexpected drop-off on radar would send emergency crews looking for you anyway.





Oh, motorcycle... right. Umm... kill switch? Solder? :Flash:

 

[teeter]

So, when your engine cuts off mid-flight, you'll need to begin procedures for an emegency landing. First locate a sutible spot by looking around quickly

Ummm yeah... in that situation I would follow these procedures:
Step 1: Crap pants
Step 2: Repeat


Back to the bike though. I will use an eraser and some di-lectric grease. I received what I wil call 100% confirmation that it's the kill switch this AM. I didn't cover the bike last night and it was drenched with dew this morning. While warming it up in neutral with the sidestand down it cut off. That prooves it's not the sidestand switch.. good. It didn't start right away after that. I worked the kill switch on/off a few times and it fired up. It died again on my way to work and again, working the switch back and forth cured it (temporarily.)

 

[Motogiro]

You could replace the switch? :BLAA:

 

[DownrangeFuture]

Ummm yeah... in that situation I would follow these procedures:
Step 1: Crap pants
Step 2: Repeat

Well, by the time you get your pilot's license you've done several power off landings, so if you lose the engine at a normal cruising distance you really only freak if you're over water or below 2000 feet. At 5-10,000 feet which is normal cruise height for a small plane, you have miles of glide distance. A Cessna 152 at 10,000 feet at the normal cruise speed of 85 KIAS, you'll cruise about an hour and go 80ish nautical miles. The whole process is around 50 minutes. Almost guaranteed there's an airport within glide distance at that point. Unless you're in the midwest, it seems there's an airport/strip every 50 miles or so. When my instructor killed the engine at 9500 feet and told me it died, fix it, I wound up gliding to an abandoned airstrip about 50 miles away and still had to bleed off altitude and speed. That was a while ago though. I did the math and figured that it was going to cost more than I was making (and more than I'm still making) to get and maintain my license.


But I digress. You should just solder the contacts together and cover it with dielectric. How often do you use the kill switch? I only use it when I'm doing maintainance on the bike. And it's not required by law or anything. I don't think...

Sorry, my brain couldn't resist taking that one literally.

 

[teeter]

You could replace the switch? :BLAA:

I've only seen the whole assembly ($170-ish) for sale. Do you have a part number for the switch? (Or is it a semi-universal item.)