WOT 1st into 2nd, clutch slipping or something else?

[Corsara]

So, I noticed today that when I go WOT in 1st gear almost to redline, then go into 2nd, the clutch seems to be slipping for almost a second before it bites completely. While it's slipping, it still seems to accelerate, just not with the same bite I guess. Is this normal? Or maybe that's not the clutch at all?

I've recently changed the oil with Yamalube 15w50, perhaps that oil is the problem?! ...although I don't remember if it was doing that before with whatever oil the original owner had in it..

 

[FinalImpact]

Make certain the clutch lever has free play. Make sure the cable is lubed also. It could be sticking after you release it.

Any chance its the tire spinning??

15 - 50 seems a bit much unless its 120F outside. If it were mine, I'd drain the oil and consider cutting open the filter to see what's in it. Do you see clutch and metal parts in the drain pan and filter pleats??? How many miles?

 

[Corsara]

Make certain the clutch lever has free play. Make sure the cable is lubed also. It could be sticking after you release it.

Any chance its the tire spinning??

15 - 50 seems a bit much unless its 120F outside. If it were mine, I'd drain the oil and consider cutting open the filter to see what's in it. Do you see clutch and metal parts in the drain pan and filter pleats??? How many miles?

Hmm...the clutch free play seems to be within specs. I haven't lubed it, but I am willing to bet it's not sticking, or it would be noticeable upon take-off as well?!

No, it's not the tire spinning, I'm sure.

I don't (didn't) know so much about the different oil values, at the dealership they were really positive that their Yamalube 15w50 is so great for both hot and also "very cold" temperatures, lol..

I just placed an order with Amsoil for their synthetic 10w40, and I will change the oil in a couple of days when it gets to my door. It's becoming pretty chilly here lately (Ontario, Canada).

 

[Corsara]

Forgot to add: bike has about 22k km, which is something like 15k miles, could it be clutch plates?

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[RJ2112]

So, I noticed today that when I go WOT in 1st gear almost to redline, then go into 2nd, the clutch seems to be slipping for almost a second before it bites completely. While it's slipping, it still seems to accelerate, just not with the same bite I guess. Is this normal? Or maybe that's not the clutch at all?

I've recently changed the oil with Yamalube 15w50, perhaps that oil is the problem?! ...although I don't remember if it was doing that before with whatever oil the original owner had in it..

If the clutch is slipping, it will become more noticeable in higher gears. Rather than rapping it out in first and feeling something on the shift to second, try riding the bike normally, up to around 25-30 MPH, and then shift it into 3rd, or 4th.

With the bike in 'too high' a gear, go to WOT, and see if the engine revs faster than the wheel speed. Higher gearing increases the demand on the clutch, and should make slippage more noticeable.

 

[ChevyFazer]

So, I noticed today that when I go WOT in 1st gear almost to redline, then go into 2nd, the clutch seems to be slipping for almost a second before it bites completely. While it's slipping, it still seems to accelerate, just not with the same bite I guess. Is this normal? Or maybe that's not the clutch at all?

I've recently changed the oil with Yamalube 15w50, perhaps that oil is the problem?! ...although I don't remember if it was doing that before with whatever oil the original owner had in it..

+1 on trying to make it slip in a higher gear but also when you shift dose the rpms seem to stay high for a second drop then come back up or stay high hold that rpm then climb, or what exactly is the rpms doing when you think its slipping, because if it is you should be feeling a surge or sudden acceleration once it catches in second gear. Also I would try a wot run from 1st to 2nd with out using the clutch if it dosnt do it without disengageing the clutch then I would say the clutch plates themselves are fine the problem might be in the linkage

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[Corsara]

If the clutch is slipping, it will become more noticeable in higher gears. Rather than rapping it out in first and feeling something on the shift to second, try riding the bike normally, up to around 25-30 MPH, and then shift it into 3rd, or 4th.

With the bike in 'too high' a gear, go to WOT, and see if the engine revs faster than the wheel speed. Higher gearing increases the demand on the clutch, and should make slippage more noticeable.

Thanks. Just went on a ride to try that---no, it doesn't seem to be slipping in this case....hmm

 

[Corsara]

+1 on trying to make it slip in a higher gear but also when you shift dose the rpms seem to stay high for a second drop then come back up or stay high hold that rpm then climb, or what exactly is the rpms doing when you think its slipping, because if it is you should be feeling a surge or sudden acceleration once it catches in second gear. Also I would try a wot run from 1st to 2nd with out using the clutch if it dosnt do it without disengageing the clutch then I would say the clutch plates themselves are fine the problem might be in the linkage

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hmm..the RPM seem to stay flat without changing during the time I think it's slipping. Then once it "bites" (that's the only way I can think about describing it), the RPM and also the speed goes up.

I also just tried a wot run from 1st to 2nd without the clutch, and it is doing the same thing (the feeling like it doesn't bite for almost a second in the WOT in 2nd).

I am confused.

 

[DownrangeFuture]

So, when you shift, are you short-shifting so much that it's bogging in second? When you're dogging it, you should really shift into second around 11500 to 13000 RPM. Preferably higher than lower. Too much below that and you'll drop way out of the power band.

If you got the bike rolling and shifted into 2nd at around 10mph, then went WOT in second it kind of does that same sensation, like nothing is happening and once the needle hits around 6k or so it's like the bike said, "Fine, we'll go. Whatever." It bites and takes off.

Although slight slippage in the clutch could still be a problem. Since the clutch is actually engaged when you're not pulling on the lever.

 

[FinalImpact]

Also I would try a wot run from 1st to 2nd with out using the clutch

NO!!!!

You could land on your @ss!

 

[ChevyFazer]

hmm..the RPM seem to stay flat without changing during the time I think it's slipping. Then once it "bites" (that's the only way I can think about describing it), the RPM and also the speed goes up.

I also just tried a wot run from 1st to 2nd without the clutch, and it is doing the same thing (the feeling like it doesn't bite for almost a second in the WOT in 2nd).

I am confused.

If the rpms are staying the same when you believe it to be slipping then it might not be slipping at all but without hearing what its doing or riding myself its just a shot in the dark, but if your having a delay before the bike goes something is off. Dose it do it at anyother times like say if you are cruising in 3rd let off the gas a little and then hit it again?

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[DownrangeFuture]

Yeah, I'd try hitting it WOT at different parts of the power band in every gear you can safely do so. You know, cause I can't really say to try hitting WOT in 5th at 9k RPM.

My gut instinct is to say you're just giving it too much throttle at too low a RPM. Dumping the clutch to WOT in 1st will make it bog even. Well, buck like a SOB and then bog, but still. It won't bog very long. It did take me awhile to retrain my ear for 13000 RPMS, I kept shifting at around 6k (like you would in a car) and the revs drop to 3k or so in second and the bike pisses and moans for a bit before taking off.

 

[Corsara]

Hi guys, no, I am not bogging it, this happens when I shift 1st to 2nd when at 12k+, and once in 2nd I keep th WOT. In fact, I also noticed it is doing it 2nd to 3rd, tried once on the highway.

The way to destcribe it is as though the tire is slipping on the ground until it grips, but I know it is not that because I doubt the bike has the power for that, also the rear end doesn't feel like it is loosing traction.

If it were the clutch, how difficult / expensive it is to replace worn parts? Is it a big job, or something that I can do myself in a couple of hours armed with standard wrenches and tools?

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[TownsendsFJR1300]

Yes, its something you can do yourself.

There's friction plates with material on them that are the wear items. There is also "steels" that go in between them. They generally don't wear but can warp and get burnt if the clutch is abused. You won't know their condition until its apart.

While there, I'd probably replace the clutch springs as well (although if within spec's you can re-use them).

The clutch is accessed under the right side cover.

Just as an FYI, the local shop I frequent had to partially pull apart an R6 as the clutch let loose from abuse. The fragments of the friction plates got all thru the engine and jambed up several gears... Not a cheap fix at that point...

 

[ChevyFazer]

Unless you or the previous owner seriously abused the clutch I doubt that is the issue being that it only has 15k on it. It sounds like something is out of adjustment

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[RJ2112]

Hi guys, no, I am not bogging it, this happens when I shift 1st to 2nd when at 12k+, and once in 2nd I keep th WOT. In fact, I also noticed it is doing it 2nd to 3rd, tried once on the highway.

The way to destcribe it is as though the tire is slipping on the ground until it grips, but I know it is not that because I doubt the bike has the power for that, also the rear end doesn't feel like it is loosing traction.

.............

This sounds more like you are hitting the rev limiter....

 

[Corsara]

This sounds more like you are hitting the rev limiter....

No, can't be. I was just out for another ride---it happens even if I'm not at such high RPM, let's say 8-9k in 1st, disengage clutch, pop 2nd, engage clutch, wot trottle ==> 1/2 second of steady RPM, no pull, then it "bites" and pulls like there's no tomorrow well, that last part is at least good

 

[Corsara]

Could it be the oil that I've put in just a few days ago? It's pretty thick 15w50 full synthetic, but temperatures are quite low these last few days (about 50-60F). I don't think it was doing that before the oil change, but then again---I wouldn't bet my life on that, the bike is new to me.

 

[ChevyFazer]

No, can't be. I was just out for another ride---it happens even if I'm not at such high RPM, let's say 8-9k in 1st, disengage clutch, pop 2nd, engage clutch, wot trottle ==> 1/2 second of steady RPM, no pull, then it "bites" and pulls like there's no tomorrow well, that last part is at least good

If the rpms are steady as well as the speed "no pull" its not the clutch or the oil it sounds more like a ignition or fuel problem

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[Corsara]

If the rpms are steady as well as the speed "no pull" its not the clutch or the oil it sounds more like a ignition or fuel problem

Fuel:
Well, I've put a K&N filter and drilled the exhaust (next week I'll be installing Leo Vince, which is in the mail). I do not have a Power Commander. Is this the kind of fuel problem you suspect (air/fuel ratio)?

Ignition:
I've never checked the condition of the spark plugs. Is this the ignition problem that you're thinking about?

Please excuse my noob questions, but I won't learn if I don't ask, so I try to ask when I don't know..