Won't start

[Blackblood]

My 2004 FZ6 has been in my warm dry shed for a few weeks now.Started and ran for a while about a week ago.

Had it out of the shed today and when I tried to start it and ride back in..Nothing

Took the battery out and had it charging for a few hours:Still nothing

It wants to start but feels like there is no spark going to any cylinder and it just bogs down,there were no error codes and the usual key-on check comes up fine.

Any suggestions? (I'm thinking it's a dead battery, 6 year old bike?)

 

[Motogiro]

If you feel like there's no spark, I would think that the engine is cranking over at a decent rate. That would indicate there is battery. Does the engine crank over easily? You said, when you turn the key on, you get the normal check. Are you hearing the fuel pump whir for a second when you turn the key to on?

 

[RJ2112]

I've had to slightly crank the throttle on, in similar circumstances..... the battery is the most likely culprit, very nearly discharged.

What kind of charger are you using, and can you have a shop load test the battery?

 

[Blackblood]

If you feel like there's no spark, I would think that the engine is cranking over at a decent rate. That would indicate there is battery. Does the engine crank over easily? You said, when you turn the key on, you get the normal check. Are you hearing the fuel pump whir for a second when you turn the key to on?

Yes I can hear the fuel pump. It all sounds completely normal until it just cranks over and does nothing.

@RJ Using a normal run of the mill 12v charger in "normal" trickle mode. I can get it tested no problem if that would be a recommendation?

 

[Motogiro]

I've had to slightly crank the throttle on, in similar circumstances..... the battery is the most likely culprit, very nearly discharged.

What kind of charger are you using, and can you have a shop load test the battery?

If the starter turns the crankshaft normally but the engine doesn't fire/start/run, it would indicate the battery is probably okay. In this case we would be affirming the engine cranks but does not run. Is this what is happening?

We could have a language barrier and be misunderstanding what we are trying to communicate because of terminology.

 

[Blackblood]

Ok.

Fuel pump whirrs when I turn the ignition on

No error code on dash

Hit the starter and the starter motor cranks the engine over

It's getting fuel because I have smelt it

Appears to be no spark to ignite the fuel


Would it help if I recorded trying to start it from key in to -trying to start?

 

[Motogiro]

Ok.

Fuel pump whirrs when I turn the ignition on

No error code on dash

Hit the starter and the starter motor cranks the engine over

It's getting fuel because I have smelt it

Appears to be no spark to ignite the fuel


Would it help if I recorded trying to start it from key in to -trying to start?

Okay so we can probably rule out the battery. You might start to check all your harness connections. There's a good chance the plugs are wet now. When was the last time you changed your plugs?

 

[Blackblood]

Approx 4000 miles ago

 

[RJ2112]

It's fairly common for a battery that is weak to be able to turn the starter, and not have enough extra to be able to fire the spark plugs. Eliiminating extra draw on the battery is the very reason the headlights do not come on, until the bike is running.....

To check that in a simple way, bump start the bike. That removes the starter's load on the battery, which should 'free up' enough current to supply the ignition.

If that works, there is a strong case for the battery being done..... this is a simpler test than hauling the battery to the shop for the load test, but it's not quite as definitive.

As I understood your first post, you ran the bike a couple of weeks ago -- you didn't say for how long, or at what RPM. (Either way, putting the battery on a trickle charger overnight should have replenished it.... but that begs the question, what is the trickle current? .1 ampere, .5 ampere, 2 ampere? A car charger is serious overkill for a an AGM motorcycle battery. )

 

[Blackblood]

It's fairly common for a battery that is weak to be able to turn the starter, and not have enough extra to be able to fire the spark plugs. Eliiminating extra draw on the battery is the very reason the headlights do not come on, until the bike is running.....

To check that in a simple way, bump start the bike. That removes the starter's load on the battery, which should 'free up' enough current to supply the ignition.

If that works, there is a strong case for the battery being done..... this is a simpler test than hauling the battery to the shop for the load test, but it's not quite as definitive.

As I understood your first post, you ran the bike a couple of weeks ago -- you didn't say for how long, or at what RPM. (Either way, putting the battery on a trickle charger overnight should have replenished it.... but that begs the question, what is the trickle current? .1 ampere, .5 ampere, 2 ampere? A car charger is serious overkill for a an AGM motorcycle battery. )

I rode it for a few miles at legal speed and came back home again. I tried bump starting it this morning before I took the battery out and it had the same effect.

The charger is old and I have no clue what ampere it puts out as trickle.I'm thinking it wasn't wise to use it (it maybe didn't help but doesn't seem to be the initial problem)

 

[RJ2112]

I rode it for a few miles at legal speed and came back home again. I tried bump starting it this morning before I took the battery out and it had the same effect.

The charger is old and I have no clue what ampere it puts out as trickle.I'm thinking it wasn't wise to use it (it maybe didn't help but doesn't seem to be the initial problem)

I'd agree that we have not sorted out what's wrong... fuel + air + spark = running motorbike. So far, we seem to be at no spark.

Check the fuses, to make sure you haven't popped one. Double check your Kill switch position. Verify the side stand immobilizer switch is working, and the clutch lever switch, and the neutral indicator.

I'm still trying to eliminate the battery; the only other way we can increase the energy available is to replace the battery. The troubleshooting way to do that is use a car battery to jump start the bike. (car off!)

If that is adequate to start it, then the battery is surely shot. If it still won't run, then something is disabling the ignition.

 

[Dennis in NH]

I had a similar problem. Mine was due to me starting the bike, running 5 seconds and then turning it off. Next day, it would not start; it would just make the whirring sound and felt like no spark.

I charged the battery real good and then tried again and this time, gave it a bunch of throttle; it caught a little and died. I tried gain and it started (along with a puff of white smoke).

Give this a try. The theory is maybe it's flooded?

Dennis

 

[Blackblood]

Thanks guys,will give it a look over after work tomorrow and report back.

Appreciate the help so far

 

[RJ2112]

Just to touch on the trickle charger again..... a 'smart' charger changes the rate of current flow over the course of time it charges a battery.

The 'bulk' rate is typically less than one ampere, which is used to get the battery to about 80% charged. This is when the charger senses 12VDC on the battery.

Then the smart chargers will all reduce the flow of current to levels much below what a trickle setting on an automotive charger will do; somewhere around 0.1 ampere.

When the smart charger senses 14 volts on the battery, they go to 'float'. They don't actually do anything other than monitor the voltage on the battery, unitl it falls below the value it's set for.... and it then returns to the very low current setting, until it gets the battery back to 14V.

AGM (absorptive glass mat) batteries are more easily damaged by overcharging than typical wet cell lead acid batteries.... the fiberglass matting doesn't let the electrolyte move very far from the plates, there's almost no circulation of liquid. When you overcharge a battery, the supphuric acid in the elecrolyte breaks down, and the sulpher bonds to the battery plates. That kills whatever part of the plate the sulpher bonds to. Cannot take a charge there ever again.

 

[Blackblood]

Thanks again for all your help so far, haven't been able to get a look at the FZ6 yet (my DRZ400S which I commute on is playing up) Will hopefully get a look at it over the weekend.

Thanks :thumbup: