water in motor oil

[ozgurakman]

Hi everyone. I've checked clutch plates 10 days ago, one of them was broken so I ordered new plates. But I need my bike almost everyday so I made the bike's pieces together, used 10 days... today I opened up clutch cover for new friction plate installing but I noticed the oil deposits on clutch cover inner walls.
p.s.: I weren't changed clutch cover gasket to new one and weren't used liquid sealant on gasket when re-installing parts.
I think there is some water leakage inside to crankcase from clutch cover...
I loosen the oil drain bolt and checked the oil, its so fine as it's new. (motul 7100)

Will problem solves If I only replace a new gasket?
Sould I have to change whole engine oil? I changed it a week ago.
P.s.:there is no deposits on engine's inside (as far as I see from hole where located at the bottom of clutch basket)

I'm living in Turkey so here's climate is winter, is concentrated water wapour and rapid teperature changes made that oil deposits?
sorry for my bad English. Thanks for any advices and thinkings.

 

[Motogiro]

When you say you have oil on the clutch basket cover I don't understand why this is an issue. The clutch on the FZ6 is a wet clutch so it is in oil.

If you have an issue with water in the oil you should see a milky tan colored slim in the oil. If the oil you drained looks like oil. If you got avery small amount of water in the oil by accident, when the engine heats the oil that moisture will evaporate an make it's way out of the crankcase. Did you soak your clutch parts in oil overnight before installing?

 

[MG-242]

Was there any indication of oil outside around the clutch cover after you first closed it back up? If the water came in around the clutch cover I would imagine it would have had to have been forced in like from a pressure hose.

I'd finish the clutch replacement and change the oil and see if the water reappears. But, you want to make sure you get the water out.

No worries - I'm certain your English is much better than my Turkish :thumbup:

 

[FinalImpact]

Lift the fuel tank and remove the air cleaner cover. 6 big screws.

This is with the cover off. See the 3 little holes on the right? The larger one to the back should be clear. If its blocked and not breathing, the engine can not breath and will hold moisture. If the hole is all white and milky looking, there may be a great source of moisture. I suspect it will be clear like the one shown here.

If it is white, we need to find the source of the moisture. Most of the drops in the photos of the clutch disks do not indicate an issue but look like water after it was opened? Could this have happened?


And yes, very GOOD POINT; I hope you soaked the plates before installing them!!!

 

[ozgurakman]

Hi everyone. There is not any oil leaking, I'm driving between short distances and here is so cold (between 0 and 5 celcius). Engine is mostly not heats comletely when I arrive and kill the engine. So I think that milky oil deposits (on clutch wall) produced because of my riding character. I checked bike again and again, so healthy so fine.
I soaked new friction plate with oil (I changed only one which is inner plate in clutch basket because it was broken).
I couldn't checked berather tube because I haven't any garage and not want to work in freezing cold. I'll open clutch cover on spring, maybe in june so I'll post the condion of clutch cover and oil.

 

[Motogiro]

Hi everyone. There is not any oil leaking, I'm driving between short distances and here is so cold (between 0 and 5 celcius). Engine is mostly not heats comletely when I arrive and kill the engine. So I think that milky oil deposits (on clutch wall) produced because of my riding character. I checked bike again and again, so healthy so fine.
I soaked new friction plate with oil (I changed only one which is inner plate in clutch basket because it was broken).
I couldn't checked berather tube because I haven't any garage and not want to work in freezing cold. I'll open clutch cover on spring, maybe in june so I'll post the condion of clutch cover and oil.

Good job! Yes, not heating engine up can cause milky moisture in the oil.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

That little bit of water droplets on the center clutch bolt is very odd.

It MUST have condensed when you pulled the cover off. It appears to have only collected (or dropped) on the denser steel nut/shaft (nothing on the aluminum in the 4th, clutch basket picture (( double clicked for close up)). under the clutch cover.. It should have mixed with the oil, it won't stay separated like that (especially buried inside the clutch)..

As stated above, the moisture should burn off. If its an honest to goodness coolant leak, your oil will turn brown and the level rise.

Two suggestions (besides Randy's checking under the tank):

(1) Keep and eye on the oil level, that its NOT INCREASING. Also, that your NOT loosing coolant (and that's staying green)

(2)More importantly, I would partially cover the radiator, (keeping an eye on the temps) and try to get the engine to heat up and burn off that moisture. Limiting air flow to the radiator show help warm up the engine. **With those cold temps, I would definitly let the engine warm up (BEFORE MOVING) enough to idle down (from the higher RPM cold start) and register on the temp gauge..

What temps are you able to get the engine to (F please, if possible) while on a commute?

BTW, were you able to account for most / all the friction plate?

I seriously doubt you have any major issues there, just try to get the engine closer to normal operating temps...

 

[ozgurakman]

That little bit of water droplets on the center clutch bolt is very odd.

It MUST have condensed when you pulled the cover off. It appears to have only collected (or dropped) on the denser steel nut/shaft (nothing on the aluminum in the 4th, clutch basket picture (( double clicked for close up)). under the clutch cover.. It should have mixed with the oil, it won't stay separated like that (especially buried inside the clutch)..

As stated above, the moisture should burn off. If its an honest to goodness coolant leak, your oil will turn brown and the level rise.

Two suggestions (besides Randy's checking under the tank):

(1) Keep and eye on the oil level, that its NOT INCREASING. Also, that your NOT loosing coolant (and that's staying green)

(2)More importantly, I would partially cover the radiator, (keeping an eye on the temps) and try to get the engine to heat up and burn off that moisture. Limiting air flow to the radiator show help warm up the engine. **With those cold temps, I would definitly let the engine warm up (BEFORE MOVING) enough to idle down (from the higher RPM cold start) and register on the temp gauge..

What temps are you able to get the engine to (F please, if possible) while on a commute?

BTW, were you able to account for most / all the friction plate?

I seriously doubt you have any major issues there, just try to get the engine closer to normal operating temps...

My fazer is 2005, so I can't see water temp, can see only air temp.
And I'm not moving the bike until engine temp gauge ups to 2 sticks.
I'm not driving for 4-5 days, weather is so terrible, extremely smoke and cold so I can't ride. oil level is fine and oil is so clear (which is on oil check stick, bottom of clutch cover)
I changed cooling water and oil same time. old oil and antifreeze-water mixture was fine and healty, I'm not sure about serius engine problems but maybe I'm not looking right spots.
I'll check the engine as soon as possible and shot some pics

p.s.: I filled new antifreeze with deionized water, antifreeze is castrol radicool

I can't understand your sentence, "were you able to account for most / all the friction plate?" what do you mean? My English is deficient, sorry

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

My fazer is 2005, so I can't see water temp, can see only air temp.
And I'm not moving the bike until engine temp gauge ups to 2 sticks.
I'm not driving for 4-5 days, weather is so terrible, extremely smoke and cold so I can't ride. oil level is fine and oil is so clear (which is on oil check stick, bottom of clutch cover)
I changed cooling water and oil same time. old oil and antifreeze-water mixture was fine and healty, I'm not sure about serius engine problems but maybe I'm not looking right spots.
I'll check the engine as soon as possible and shot some pics

p.s.: I filled new antifreeze with deionized water, antifreeze is castrol radicool

I can't understand your sentence, "were you able to account for most / all the friction plate?" what do you mean? My English is deficient, sorry

Sorry, Mine shows temps in numbers, yours is in bars.

If two bars is normal during summer your good. If its normally at 4 bars during normal summertime riding, again, I'd close off some air to the radiator some to get the engine (and most importantly, the engine oil) up to normal temps and burn off that probable condensation/water...

It really doesn't sound as if you have an issue. Your maintainance sounds like your doing things dead on correct...:thumbup:

Re the clutch plates, I was asking, if the FRICTION (not the smooth steel plate) plate that broke, were you able to pluck ALL OF it out of the engine?

 

[ozgurakman]

Sorry, Mine shows temps in numbers, yours is in bars.

If two bars is normal during summer your good. If its normally at 4 bars during normal summertime riding, again, I'd close off some air to the radiator some to get the engine (and most importantly, the engine oil) up to normal temps and burn off that probable condensation/water...

It really doesn't sound as if you have an issue. Your maintainance sounds like your doing things dead on correct...:thumbup:

Re the clutch plates, I was asking, if the FRICTION (not the smooth steel plate) plate that broke, were you able to pluck ALL OF it out of the engine?

in summer, gauge shows 3 bars when fully warmed. four is some overheated, 5 is (which have 2 bars' height) is serious overheating.
so 2 is not bad for start to ride I think, but I'll close the radiator litle bit with something.

Plate was broken but when I put the parts together, almost nothing is missing on plate but I washed up the engine with some semi-syn 10w40 mobil s2000 because that was my first oil change and not know which brand oil and viscosity inside the engine, moreover some little parts -look like fine sand and oil is some darker as new- were when I poured the mobil oil... (After warming engine, I poured cheap oil and filled motul 7100 10w40)
In short, I think I washed engine well and there is nothing to consider twice. We'll see :thumbup:

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Sounds like you got it under control! :thumbup:

Just curious, when the friction plate "broke", what exactly happened to it? (IE did it come apart into different pieces, lost some raised blocks, etc)?

Also, when possible, I would replace all the friction plates (don't really know how you got just ONE plate) as you don't really know the condition of those from the PO's riding habits.

Its kinda rare to break them unless you seriously abuse the clutch. Slippiing from old age, wear is one thing, broke in pieces-likely abuse...

 

[ozgurakman]

Sounds like you got it under control! :thumbup:

Just curious, when the friction plate "broke", what exactly happened to it? (IE did it come apart into different pieces, lost some raised blocks, etc)?

Also, when possible, I would replace all the friction plates (don't really know how you got just ONE plate) as you don't really know the condition of those from the PO's riding habits.

Its kinda rare to break them unless you seriously abuse the clutch. Slippiing from old age, wear is one thing, broke in pieces-likely abuse...

I checked another all plates with micrometer, whey are fine. My bike has just 32k Kilometers (~19.2k miles)
I have a blog, you can watch vid and check out my site how I did, it's Turkish but I think you can understand them all when you look for medias (photos/vids).

yamaha fz6 fazer

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I checked another all plates with micrometer, whey are fine. My bike has just 32k Kilometers (~19.2k miles)
I have a blog, you can watch vid and check out my site how I did, it's Turkish but I think you can understand them all when you look for medias (photos/vids).

yamaha fz6 fazer

I couldn't get it to open....

How were you able to obtain ONE clutch plate and not the set (as recomended by Yamaha)?

 

[ozgurakman]

I couldn't get it to open....

How were you able to obtain ONE clutch plate and not the set (as recomended by Yamaha)?

I bought it from ebay (USA), it's also selling alone at Yammy shops in Turkey. and nothing did when it broke. Anybody can't understand if it's broken but this is fazer's chronical problem I think because mayn fz6 fazer's first friction plate breaks... just little bit more clunky when shifting from first to second.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezE235PX5LY]debriyaj balatas? de?i?imi - YouTube[/ame]

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Sent you a PM.

BTW, I could see water on the frame in your pictures, either rain or condensation, that's what was inside that clutch retaining bolt, etc... Your fine there...

Glad all the broken clutch was there.

If you check the shop manual or parts fisch, the very inner friction and very outer friction plates are different from the rest.

Its a different part #, the ones inbetween, per the manual, are said to be brown..

I don't know if their thicker or thinner, it doesn't address it.