union
- Thread starter coursonap
- Start date
I have no choice but to join a union,
My profession means that I am required to have indemnity insurance, my union provides the indemnity.
I think that nursing unions are slightly different to trade unions as you rarely hear of them being successful in negotiating better rates of pay, rarely support industrial action etc.
They are very good at giving legal advice though.
I agree with unions in principle.
Nelly
My profession means that I am required to have indemnity insurance, my union provides the indemnity.
I think that nursing unions are slightly different to trade unions as you rarely hear of them being successful in negotiating better rates of pay, rarely support industrial action etc.
They are very good at giving legal advice though.
I agree with unions in principle.
Nelly
4fun
Member #1360
I agree that there can be some that are good and serve a purpose, there can even be a difference between here and across the pond by you. I believe that the original purpose of the Unions was great, but like so many other things, it got exploited.
Glad to here that your with a good organization.:thumbup:
4fun
Member #1360
And I thought that you just loved to pay the Union dues!
urbanj
Junior Member
If it's a good union and good company then its all good
if it's a good union and bad company then unions are good
if its a bad union and good company then its all good
if its a bad union and bad company then you are F**ked
no one forces companies to hire bad, lazy workers. and if the company has appropriate policies and structure to what they do in terms of discipling or repremanding employees then even a union wont help you.
my last job was for a big railroad company in canada. the union was in the back pocket of the company. it would have been better not to have the union because you couldnt even fight anything because the union would just sign off on it saying it was ok. so in that situation. Unions are bad.
I now work for the government. so things are done fairly and there has never been an issue where the union was even needed really. everything is taken care of in house.
if it's a good union and bad company then unions are good
if its a bad union and good company then its all good
if its a bad union and bad company then you are F**ked
no one forces companies to hire bad, lazy workers. and if the company has appropriate policies and structure to what they do in terms of discipling or repremanding employees then even a union wont help you.
my last job was for a big railroad company in canada. the union was in the back pocket of the company. it would have been better not to have the union because you couldnt even fight anything because the union would just sign off on it saying it was ok. so in that situation. Unions are bad.
I now work for the government. so things are done fairly and there has never been an issue where the union was even needed really. everything is taken care of in house.
Well I guess the strict constructionists of the Republican Party think socialism is bad for the middle class and working poor but it is great for the corporations and the wealthy!
2004Ralli//art
Member
well...in my opinion...truely...truely..the only thing a union can gaurantee, is a loss of job...when it comes down to it, the company is still the one that decides what your raise is, and your benefits and everything like that...sure the union can SAY we'll get you this or that...but all they can do is try...the can promise you it...and it really makes for a lazy work place...bc whether your the best employee or the worst...your still the same in a union environment...just my opinion though :rockon:
Cuba
Junior Member
We have watched unions systematically destroy the US airline industry and auto manufacturing and drive up costs across the board on everything they touch all while providing substandard work. Yeah they're great! $72/hr to unload a truck and stage furniture in Philly. Even if your project does not require union labor you will be picketted, threatened, vandalized, and possibly assaulted. Doing an install in Philly requires around the clock security to protect against unions committing these crimes. Whenever we do use union labor for state or federal jobs not only are our margins destroyed but the tax payers take a huge hit as well.
If unions had workers in mind they would maintain a level of reality in their negotiations. They are biting the hand that feeds them and in today's (and most certainly tomorrow's) economy they will simply lose their jobs. Don't argue that companies are wrong to ship jobs overseas when union labor alternatives are absolutely impossible to use. They are unsustainable and breed unemployment for the young. Take a good look at France for a moment, then come back to the realities of the world. Just the opinion of one antisocialist, take it for what it is.
Edit: I'm not knocking ALL unions, some are good, some are effective, but in my experience and opinion most are counter productive.
If unions had workers in mind they would maintain a level of reality in their negotiations. They are biting the hand that feeds them and in today's (and most certainly tomorrow's) economy they will simply lose their jobs. Don't argue that companies are wrong to ship jobs overseas when union labor alternatives are absolutely impossible to use. They are unsustainable and breed unemployment for the young. Take a good look at France for a moment, then come back to the realities of the world. Just the opinion of one antisocialist, take it for what it is.
Edit: I'm not knocking ALL unions, some are good, some are effective, but in my experience and opinion most are counter productive.
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D-Mac
Distance Rider
Shouldn't this be posted in 'The Bar'? I thought General Discussion was for general topics related to the FZ6......
On the subject, I belonged to a union once (no choice). It helped keep from getting us screwed (we were much better paid than non-union employees at equilivent institutions). It was also a good place to go for legal advice. Their attempts at job action to improve our benefits plan failed miserably though.
On the subject, I belonged to a union once (no choice). It helped keep from getting us screwed (we were much better paid than non-union employees at equilivent institutions). It was also a good place to go for legal advice. Their attempts at job action to improve our benefits plan failed miserably though.
coursonap
Senior Member
Sorry about not putting this in the right forum didnt think about that when I was posting it. I do have to thank everybody about keeping it civil. I know this can become a very heated subject.:rockon:
poorwboy
New Member
I'm union (local 12) and I am by no means lazy. I bust my a$$ everyday.
Unions do have ups and downs. They want your dues, but when you want something there not there.
Unions do have ups and downs. They want your dues, but when you want something there not there.
2004Ralli//art
Member
oh dude...lol....i'm not saying that everyone is lazy...it in theory can just make for a lazy environment...i know it did for my work place
but yeah thats true too..they have no problem collecting due's...but sometimes i think you should get more than what your paying for
fz6RIDER600
Junior Member
I was a teamster for some years, and after all I saw I believe there not needed anymore!
I left my job because I was paying to be in this union and they don't deliver what they promise!
For me I hated both management and the union! I was in the middle!
I decided to leave and go back to school!
I left my job because I was paying to be in this union and they don't deliver what they promise!
For me I hated both management and the union! I was in the middle!
I decided to leave and go back to school!
Yup, have seen that and they are usually the old and grumpy dinosours who have been there for ages and you can't do a damn thing about it.
Back in my glory days, I use to deal with stagehands (IATSE) who were union at most of the venues. Since I'm the one settleling the show on behalf of the artist with the promoters, going over show expenses was part of the settlement. Guess what the biggest show expense was if it was a union building? Yup, stagehands. If it was a holiday, or even on a Sunday, the bill was even bigger. If you were in the Northeast like New York, Phl, or Boston, they are even more expensive. And if the aritst ever filmed or recorded at these venues with strong unions like New York, the fees are even higher as the stagehands get a recording fee. So if you ever saw a dvd video of an artist that was filmed at Madson Square Garden in New York, or heard a recorded live song from there, you can bet those stagehands made some great money ontop of their already outrageous wages. Example, Forklift drivers making $120-$160 (overtime)per hour.
Silly things like you can't simply plug your extention cord into the side of the wall. You have to have a union electrician do that.
Union's are great for job security, but from my experience, they have protected lazy,old, greedy workers who should have been fired long time. And some of their wages and demands are way out of line. I have also come across some great union guys, who are hard workers and have great work ethics, but they are few and far between.
By working for the public sector (community colleges) I have the first hand experience with my local union chapter. On the one hand I've seen situations where the union would not offer assistance to employees when needed. On the other hand, I've seen the union bargain for health benefits, time off work, etc. I must say that generally speaking the public sector employees get paid considerably less than those holding comparable job classifications in the private sector. It is sad that because of the unions lazy employees can hardly be fired, and those that perform above par do not get rewarded with bonuses. I think that if the unions were not corrupted they could be a good thing. That is not what I have seen. Anyway, I think that good employees should be rewarded (via bonuses, and promotions) and not performing employees should be let go.
FzPilot
Junior Member
voted: NO
And without getting into great detail, (I could go on for hours about my experience with unions) I will give you a quick example.
In my previous job:
It took me 15 minutes to exchange damaged robotic arm at a non-union shop so that the company could continue production and not loose thousands every single minute.
It took me exactly 4 hours to do the SAME EXACT job at a union shop. And that is a fact I am NOT exaggerating the difference.
Both companies are in same business manufacturing exactly same components. Today the non-union shop continues to run through these tough economic times. The union shop, went out of business more than a year ago. Taking with it the entire small town that was employed at that company. And that is also a fact.
And without getting into great detail, (I could go on for hours about my experience with unions) I will give you a quick example.
In my previous job:
It took me 15 minutes to exchange damaged robotic arm at a non-union shop so that the company could continue production and not loose thousands every single minute.
It took me exactly 4 hours to do the SAME EXACT job at a union shop. And that is a fact I am NOT exaggerating the difference.
Both companies are in same business manufacturing exactly same components. Today the non-union shop continues to run through these tough economic times. The union shop, went out of business more than a year ago. Taking with it the entire small town that was employed at that company. And that is also a fact.
luckyirishboy209
custom fz6 foot peg maker
the union keeps a paycheck coming to me every Friday! i wouldn't have my fz6 if it wasn't for the union. my family wouldn't have food and all of the medical, dental, vision, and other benefits. you wouldn't have highways, sidewalks, schools etc.
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