Tuning fuel and ignition for operation on premium fuel?

[Sl!pstream]

Hey folks, lately I've been contemplating putting some more time into tuning the FZ to take advantage of higher octane fuel. From what I gather, in stock trim these bikes are supposed to run on 87 octane fuel, however given that the FZ motor is of the R6/R6S family (which make or power and are intended for use with premium fuel), there is surely some more power to be unlocked with this engine.

Earlier this year I installed a slip-on exhaust, power commander V, and had the the bike dyno tuned by a local shop with premium fuel in the tank (I've included a screenshot below). The dyno tune appears to be an across the board map regardless of gear selection, which is somewhat concerning since supposedly fuel and spark advance vary by gear in the ECU from what I've read in a few threads on here, and strangely only says cylinders 1 and 2.

Power and torque figures where right where they should be for a stock bike, 89 rwhp and 43 ft/lbs of torque. So in order to get more power out of the higher octane fuel, I'm under the impression I also will need to advance the ignition timing as well and not just have the fueling adjusted, since the burn rate/volatility of higher octane fuel is different. I am completely inexperienced when it comes to tuning for both fuel and ignition stuff, and I would like to gather some insight from anyone who has done self tunes for fuel tables, and also adjusted their own ignition timing. I would prefer to be able to electronically adjust the ignition (so I can have the option to adjust it independent of each gear instead of modifying the timing trigger wheel to "spoof" the ecu into adding a certain amount of timing across the board in addition to what is programmed for each gear), but it doesn't seem like there is an ignition module available for the PCV for the FZ6. From what I've been reading, the only solution may be at the ECU level itself with a "flash", however it seems like most of the open source or owner developed software resources for ECU flashing are limited to the R6 and R1.

Any advice from folks who modified their bikes in the manner I described would be much appreciated.

 

[vr46fan]

I believe you can only tune the fuel. To change the timing, you have to notch the trigger wheel and mechanically advance the timing. Look up member Finalimpact, as he has done this with good results.


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[Sl!pstream]

I'm aware of the practice of physically modifying the trigger wheel to "trick" the ecu, but AFAIK this is just an across the board value increase and doesn't take into account the varied ignition curves programmed into the ECU for lower gears. I specifically want to have have electronic control over all these values so more precise tuning can be done.

 

[FinalImpact]

AFAIK there are no solutions except ecu flash is once again a grey area as anyone doing it for you will be making an educated guess on the advance rate for this bike. If they undershoot - money wasted. If they overshoot - it could result in engine damage.

So the happy spot is "likely" something between the 3rd and 4th gear profiles with the addition of 6 to 8° added to those curves. What i dont know is the rate and at what rpm it hurts more than it helps.

Bottom line is there is no off the shelf plug and play solution or I would have it.

I do have a spare ecu, trigger, pickup coil, and wiring harness and the intent to solve the riddle.
If I had an S2 cluster I would figure it out. So, anyone willing to loan out an S2 gauge and I'll plot the curves per gear and see what they are stock. It is possible.

I see you're PDX, call EDR Performance and get an answer from them. They can flash but refuse to give details. I've spoken with them 3x and they said they'd call back with an answer bit that has yet to happen in 9mo at roughly 3mo intervals...

PS - bang per buck, its hard to beat what a few files strokes can do for $0.00 investment!

 

[Sl!pstream]

AFAIK there are no solutions except ecu flash is once again a grey area as anyone doing it for you will be making an educated guess on the advance rate for this bike. If they undershoot - money wasted. If they overshoot - it could result in engine damage.

So the happy spot is "likely" something between the 3rd and 4th gear profiles with the addition of 6 to 8° added to those curves. What i dont know is the rate and at what rpm it hurts more than it helps.

Bottom line is there is no off the shelf plug and play solution or I would have it.

I do have a spare ecu, trigger, pickup coil, and wiring harness and the intent to solve the riddle.
If I had an S2 cluster I would figure it out. So, anyone willing to loan out an S2 gauge and I'll plot the curves per gear and see what they are stock. It is possible.

I see you're PDX, call EDR Performance and get an answer from them. They can flash but refuse to give details. I've spoken with them 3x and they said they'd call back with an answer bit that has yet to happen in 9mo at roughly 3mo intervals...

I'm currently down in Corvallis for school, not many bike shops around here, and certainly none that are experts in tuning. I'm not willing to do business with EDR after the misinformation I was given about tuning options/potential, in addition to other reasons over the course of the past year (friends engine build taking 7 months longer than quoted to complete, among other things). If anyone is touching the fuel and ignition values on my bike from here on out, it will be Nels 2wheel dynoworks in Seattle.

What I'm gathering is that if I want anything but a "send your ecu off to some person to do some black magic behind a curtain" solution, Im going to need to completely reverse engineer the ECU. There's software out there that can mess with R1 and R6 ECUs. Take a look at some of the threads on ECU hacking, and this video which shows basically what I'd want to achieve in the endgame. While there may not be premade firmware/definitions/whatever you want to call it that exists for this bike for converting binary/hex into something tuner programs can use, but with any luck the ECU will be from a similar Denso/mitsubishi family with the same controller/EEPROM/other sub circuits so there may be some sort of overlap, and it wouldn't mean completely starting from scratch.

[video=youtube;yix7UG9oVbo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yix7UG9oVbo&feature=youtu.be[/video]

If I had a spare S2 ecu to play with I might take some time to pursue reverse engineering it or enlisting an electrical and computer engineering geek here at the university to help me with the process (time to make the brain hurt!), as my main concern with using my own is "bricking" the ECU. I'm very interested in learning how to do my own tunes, but it will be a big learning curve since I'm starting with no experience and very little knowledge about messing with this stuff. It would also be a great contribution to the community if resources for ECU flashing could be shared with others here on the forum, assuming any of us ever "crack" our ECU.