Timing, timing timing!!

[FinalImpact]

I don't think we could hurt this thread any so lets dump all we find in it. Good bad or otherwise. . . .

Sadly the Yamaha ATV group can hook up laptops to their machines with a few add-ons and swap curves on everything. . . Yet it costs us a fortune!

 

[Guitar Man]

So I was digging through the manual and on page 2-12 it says that the timing is 5 degrees BTDC. It has a digital advancer so it's not a set timing. I have to wonder now what is the range of the digital advancer (this is in the ECU I'm thinking).

I'm thinking now maybe 1 or 2 degrees would probably be pretty safe. It still takes time for the fuel air mixture to burn. I don't know if I would go much beyond that. You don't want combustion happening at TDC or beyond it.

 

[Guitar Man]

I should have clarified that more. The timing is 5 degrees before TDC at 1300rpm. So that's what it's doing at idle. The digital advance is a function of the ECU and gets the information from the crankcase position sensor.

 

[FinalImpact]

From what I've read as long as it's not pinging that's the main thing.

At WOT there is so much going on you may not hear it. . .

but what he said it true - advancing it can lead to reduced throttle opening for the light loads.

 

[Guitar Man]

Should not really be a problem for normal riding. If you like to go WOT then I would worry because you're right, can't hear anything at those revs. You would have to go ride it at WOT before modding and pay attention to how it performs to get a sort of baseline to what's going on.

I have to wonder if there is a limitation on the range that the digital advance has, or if it will compensate no matter what. No way of knowing really. You would have to talk to that company that does the reflash on the ECU to find out.

 

[DHoback]

I'm guessing the OP's bike went KABOOM, or there would have been a followup....

Pity, as this was very interesting!

If you get your ECU reflashed, I know they modify the engine deceleration properties (engine braking) so it makes me wonder if this is something they do in the reflash.

This might be a far cheaper way of obtaining at least some of the benefits?

Cheers,
Rick

Funny comments! No didnt go KABOOM! Bike still runs great. I have no problems hanging with the 600cc supersports. Im still looking into a controller to be able to be able to map timing and raise rev limit. Unfortunately ECU unleashed is the only one and way too much $$. Im now in the process of putting a full suspension and R6 cams in. I was able to hit 155mph with some to spare in it's current config.(and Im a 225lb rider w/ no gear.

 

[DHoback]

Oh, and sorry guys. Still no dyno. Maybe after I fit the cams and PC5. But if you see a mean looking, lowered black FZ6 running up and down I95 in PA, dont challenge. You will get blown away.

 

[SweaterDude]

I'm definitely watching this now, but TBH I have a completely stock FZ and I've hit 138mph (and 130 with bags) without full tuck with a bit to spare. All I really want to know is, do you get more low end grunt by doing this? I couldn't care less about top end speed. The best riding is done between 20-90mph so improved grunt and mids would be the real benefit, if that is accomplished

 

[fazil]

Subscribed with a great pleasure.
Did you have any low end torque with this timing mod?

Looking forward to hear about R6 cam change also.
Will you degree the cams also when you put them?
Photographs would be good.

 

[DHoback]

Well guys, I have destroyed a CBR and Gixer 600 off the line through 3rd before letting off. And I keep up pretty well with my buddy with an R1 till about 4th gear. So you decide if what I have done has added anything down low. ****! better yet, just try it! Its easy and you can put it right back to stock if you want. Remember, this is not the only only thing I have done to the bike. Oh, and still no KABOOM!

 

[fazil]

Do you have a photo of the modded ignition rotor?
Power commander has an ignition module that can be connected to Pc3 or Pc5.
Can it be used for timing with Fz6?

 

[Guitar Man]

I would really like to see a pic myself to see exactly what you did.

 

[red_rock_beetle]

yes, i believe detailed pictures are in order
:thumbup:

 

[DHoback]

Sorry guys, no pics. Its pretty straight forward. Remove the engine cover and the bolt holding the rotor to the end of the crank. Looking at the rotor, you will see the detent cutout. You have to file the left side of the cutout so that that you can advance the rotor clockwise.

 

[fazil]

Can you make a sketch for us using this photo

 

[ivor1980]

Really would like to try this.How to accurately measure the angle?torque angle gauge would be quite crude I think!

 

[rk8950]

anyone know how much you would file off detent?

 

[FinalImpact]

Well that depends how much you'd like to advance the timing. Warning up front is if you move it more than a few degrees your fuel cost will go up as it has to have improved octane to save the engine and benefit from advancing the timing.

The math is in another thread and the calculation based upon the diameter that allows movement which is the nub on the inside of the trigger wheel. See posts 5 and 10 of this thread. Final Imppact Winter project; playing w/trigger
http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-...imppact-winter-project-playing-w-trigger.html

IDR the exact numbers as they're written on paper at home. But if you move the OD 0.100", that's roughly 5° (10° total) and too much for some applications.

 

[rk8950]

Thanks for the help. Yeah Im not worried on fuel cost got this thing as a toy, I am kinda new to the street but I do MX every weekend. I want to advance 4-6 degrees. Is there any other cheap mods? I drilled the baffles 3/4" but didnt really notice a difference in power but sounds a little better. It is a 05 fz6