short in starter switch mid-ride

[gnyce]

Lovely day for a ride. About halfway through, saw the engine light was one. Pulled over immediately, suspecting overheating/fan not running. Pulled off helmet and realized that engines sounds 'odd'... even though the engine was running, the starter was engaged. Turned off key... gave a visual all around... turned key on, and starter kicked in immediately. Messed with the starter rocker/switch, could _sort_ of toggle it. Finally pulled out the tools under the seat, took off the cover/shroud, and messed in there. Dilemma... I could disconnect one of the wires (blue/black), but how would I know if I could get it started again? I could let it start and them fumble will pulling a wire out. Sidenote: off all the tools included, no pliers? Need to put a needlenose in there,or maybe a leatherman. Sidenote: I stopped using the kill switch about a week ago, after reading warnings here about how this was a known-issue with the bike... so some irony here.

In the end, I decided to try to limp home (about 5 miles) and use my thumb to try to keep the starter from engaging by wiggling the switch. Was saved by two guys that pulled up, on one a hayabusa all decked out. They didn't have a pliers, but they did have a wire-stripper. So I exposed the blue/black wires as they run out of the switch... cut the blue... stripped it a bit back on both sides... touched/arced it to start the bike and then pulled them apart (and wrapped them up as best I could). Ride home was fine.

Questions:

1 - based on my description, any reason to think it is something _other_ than the starter-switch?
2 - what should I have done instead?
3 - did I cause myself any other issues by my actions?
4 - have the bike on a battery-charger, just in case
5 - could I have jacked up the starter, having it run and run while the engine is already running?
6 - what other tools should I have under my seat?

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Lovely day for a ride. About halfway through, saw the engine light was one. Pulled over immediately, suspecting overheating/fan not running. Pulled off helmet and realized that engines sounds 'odd'... even though the engine was running, the starter was engaged. Turned off key... gave a visual all around... turned key on, and starter kicked in immediately. Messed with the starter rocker/switch, could _sort_ of toggle it. Finally pulled out the tools under the seat, took off the cover/shroud, and messed in there. Dilemma... I could disconnect one of the wires (blue/black), but how would I know if I could get it started again? I could let it start and them fumble will pulling a wire out. Sidenote: off all the tools included, no pliers? Need to put a needlenose in there,or maybe a leatherman. Sidenote: I stopped using the kill switch about a week ago, after reading warnings here about how this was a known-issue with the bike... so some irony here.

In the end, I decided to try to limp home (about 5 miles) and use my thumb to try to keep the starter from engaging by wiggling the switch. Was saved by two guys that pulled up, on one a hayabusa all decked out. They didn't have a pliers, but they did have a wire-stripper. So I exposed the blue/black wires as they run out of the switch... cut the blue... stripped it a bit back on both sides... touched/arced it to start the bike and then pulled them apart (and wrapped them up as best I could). Ride home was fine.

Questions:

1 - based on my description, any reason to think it is something _other_ than the starter-switch?
2 - what should I have done instead?
3 - did I cause myself any other issues by my actions?
4 - have the bike on a battery-charger, just in case
5 - could I have jacked up the starter, having it run and run while the engine is already running?
6 - what other tools should I have under my seat?

The owners MANUAL should be under your seat.


Anyway, sounds like the starter switch FUBAR, (kinda unusual)

If you have the manual under the seat and/or know where the starter relay is, simply un-plug it. Then PUSH START the bike by-passing the starter.

The starter is probably ok but you won't know definitely until you fix the main issue.

You said the "STARTER SWITCH", ( Not the Kill switch, CORRECT?)

Pull the assembly apart and inspect. Most likely, especially if you, playing with it, made a difference, somethings jacked up in there.

The starter relay could have froze on, but from your description, sounds like its in the button assembly, broken spring, etc sticking on...


Disconnecting the main wire to the starter (if you could get to it and insulate it would work too) to get home.

If you look at the diagram: Yamaha Motorcycle Parts 2007 FZ6 - FZS6W STARTER Diagram
the starter goes up against a rotating gear, so worse case scenario, the starter was spinning constantly-some excess heat in the starter, constant cranking, etc..

 

[gnyce]

Thanks Scott. Don't have an owner's manual, but you are right, that would be a good idea (and honestly didn't occur to me... sheesh)... guess I have _two_ things to order. Definitely referring to the starter switch, not the kill switch.

It was odd... I backed out the screw in that button assembly, put it back.... turned on the key... nothing... then 15 seconds later (and me not touching anything), the starter would start to turn the engine over. Almost positive it is in that button assembly... yeah, could be wrong, but wiggling it seemed to (sometimes) make a difference (starter cranking, then not). Glad to be home, and that I worked it out enough to get here.

But minus that - what an absolutely beautiful day to be out. So so glad to be on this bike.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I'd open up the switch and GENTLY pull it apart (as most of the innerds is plastic.

There should be a spring in there. Either that failed or a tab (allowing it to move in the out) broke off, perhaps the metal contact plate came loose.

I do have the S2 owners manual as a PDF if you need it(Kinda hard to keep under the seat), PM me with an e-mail address and I'll send it to you..

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Any updates?

 

[gnyce]

Replacement part arrived yesterday from partzilla - decided on a 11 year-old bike, and if the kill switch is a known issue, might as well just replace it. Lots of kids-sporting events so wont' get to it on Saturday, but maybe Sunday. However - I've ridden it a couple of times between then and now - it's like my own/personal anti-theft device, I just arc the wires across when I need the starter to engage :rockon:

 

[FinalImpact]

One thing to note is the overrun clutch on the starter pretty much allowed the starter to spin in a loadless state while the engine is running.
Point; the starter wasn't really doing any work as the engine idle speed is faster than the starters cranking speed. So the starter may be fine...

If you pull the starter relay and connect a hand held multimeter set to DC volts, you can verify switch actuation without abusing the starter...

I'd consider solenoid replacement tho...

 

[gnyce]

Will consider solenoid, but in the meantime - switch is replaced and all is well! Did I see someone say about an hour to replace? Granted I was fumbling about, but it was more than an hour just to get it out. Rather be careful then screw up something else though. Airbox and battery came out to get to the harness, but seems fine now - left the key/battery on for about 10 minutes, just to make sure it didn't magically start turning over again. Thanks for those who weighed in. Nice to have my first 'repair' under my belt. Can't wait to see what's next. Hopefully not a clutch-cable tale like agf just had...

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Out of curiosity, did you pull the old one apart and see what failed (push spring)?

Yours is the first starter button to fail that I've seen here...


And save your kill switch parts if their still good. Should that fail, you have to buy the entire assembly.

 

[gnyce]

Out of curiosity, did you pull the old one apart and see what failed (push spring)?

Yours is the first starter button to fail that I've seen here...

Didn't yet, but I intend to, yeah, will let you know what I find.

And save your kill switch parts if their still good. Should that fail, you have to buy the entire assembly.

Will do so, thks.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Besides curiosity, I like to make sure the part I replaced WAS broke, just in case a relay stuck on, etc, may have been causing the issue, etc.


Here's a pic of a Yamaha F150 outboard engine starter relay (from my boat) that occasionally gave me a click and NO CRANK. I wanted to confirm the relay was bad (about $90!!) but cheaper than getting stuck and towed...

Confirmed, fried contact: