e85 and FZ6

[Eugene_sto]

hello everyone! I've been thinking about converting my straight gasoline fz6 to flex fuel fz6. It doesn't look very complicated - all we need is one kit and pair of hands growing from right place.
Im doing this thing only for educational purposes. This won't improve my gas mileage, won't save me money and won't improve our environment (well it might but just a bit).
Im an international college student majoring in biofuels. We converted several cars last year and all of them perfectly run on any mixture of gasoline and ethanol (honda accord, toyota camry, few small 4 cyl trucks). So Im pretty sure it will not damage my engine parts or fuel lines (those bikes were designed to run on at least 10% ethanol mixture). However, ethanol is a good solvent and I could have few problems with clogging fuel pump but it should't be a big deal.
To be honest we never had ant troubles with ethanol in modern engines, except 2 cycle small motors like one you can find in weed eaters or chain saws. Even then we had troubles only after few months of storing with full tanks of fuel (it was regular gasoline with 10% of ethanol in it).

So I want to hear you professional opinion and suggestions about it. What should I be aware of?

Please no discussion about pros and cons of biofuels or fuel vs food debates.

 

[04fizzer]

A slight modification to what you said:

Your fuel mileage WILL decrease (there's less stored energy in ethanol than gasoline), and the standard fuel is a MAX of 10% ethanol, not minimum. There's also rumors going around of a change to a max of 15%, which will really suck.

What sorts of changes did you make to the cars that you worked on? I'm curious about what kind of "kit" you're looking at using.

 

[Eugene_sto]

A slight modification to what you said:

Your fuel mileage WILL decrease (there's less stored energy in ethanol than gasoline), and the standard fuel is a MAX of 10% ethanol, not minimum. There's also rumors going around of a change to a max of 15%, which will really suck.

What sorts of changes did you make to the cars that you worked on? I'm curious about what kind of "kit" you're looking at using.

Here is the kit and here is the instruction . Process is exactly the same for cars.
You are absolutely right about gas mileage and BTUs in one gallon of e85 vs gasoline. Most sites that sell those kits emphasize high octane of e85 which is kinda true, but it won't make any difference with default engine compression. Same thing with bikes. Few years ago I've read a report where guys made about 5%-10% mpg improvement on e85 by increasing compression. It was some small Ford car from 90's, I can't recall the model right now. On the other hand the same improvement made this engine run ONLY on high octane fuels.
If you can compression vary...for example by using turbo charger then it might work with all kind of octane...
Im not a mechanic tho.

 

[LERecords]

I've thought about this too and it really isnt that many changes.. only possibly hic-cup i thought of would be the stuff inside the tank.. fuel economy would decreas from say 35mpg to around what 32mpg.. 30mpg.. I know it would be a bit lower... to maximize this however, you would want to get some tuning software and have the bike dyno'd a few times.. with a proper tune, the bike would run at maximum mpg (with the proper rider of course)..

I have no knowledge on this part, but what about the exhaust system when running ethonol?? header, cat, and back to the muffler and (for those of us with stock) that plastic shroud?? what about people with leos, scorps and other aftermarket??? what is the effect of burning e-whatever grade in the long run on parts of the bike??

 

[Eugene_sto]

A slight modification to what you said:

Your fuel mileage WILL decrease (there's less stored energy in ethanol than gasoline), and the standard fuel is a MAX of 10% ethanol, not minimum. There's also rumors going around of a change to a max of 15%, which will really suck.

What sorts of changes did you make to the cars that you worked on? I'm curious about what kind of "kit" you're looking at using.

Here is the kit and here is the instruction . Process is exactly the same for cars.
You are absolutely right about gas mileage and BTUs in one gallon of e85 vs gasoline. Most sites that sell those kits emphasize high octane of e85 which is kinda true, but it won't make any difference with default engine compression. Same thing with bikes. Few years ago I've read a report where guys made about 5%-10% mpg improvement on e85 by increasing compression. It was some small Ford car from 90's, I can't recall the model right now. On the other hand the same improvement made this engine run ONLY on high octane fuels.
If you can compression vary...for example by using turbo charger then it might work with all kind of octane...
Im not a mechanic tho.

 

[04fizzer]

I'm surprised that there's nothing stated about changing the fuel lines. I'd heard that E85 will eat standard lines.

You may want to do some more research before getting too far into this.

 

[Eugene_sto]

I've thought about this too and it really isnt that many changes.. only possibly hic-cup i thought of would be the stuff inside the tank.. fuel economy would decreas from say 35mpg to around what 32mpg.. 30mpg.. I know it would be a bit lower... to maximize this however, you would want to get some tuning software and have the bike dyno'd a few times.. with a proper tune, the bike would run at maximum mpg (with the proper rider of course)..

I have no knowledge on this part, but what about the exhaust system when running ethonol?? header, cat, and back to the muffler and (for those of us with stock) that plastic shroud?? what about people with leos, scorps and other aftermarket??? what is the effect of burning e-whatever grade in the long run on parts of the bike??

Yep. I never tried just because of money. Kit is about $400 + power commander + proper mapping + dyno test... too much for a student lol

 

[04fizzer]

I've thought about this too and it really isnt that many changes.. only possibly hic-cup i thought of would be the stuff inside the tank.. fuel economy would decreas from say 35mpg to around what 32mpg.. 30mpg.. I know it would be a bit lower... to maximize this however, you would want to get some tuning software and have the bike dyno'd a few times.. with a proper tune, the bike would run at maximum mpg (with the proper rider of course)..

I have no knowledge on this part, but what about the exhaust system when running ethonol?? header, cat, and back to the muffler and (for those of us with stock) that plastic shroud?? what about people with leos, scorps and other aftermarket??? what is the effect of burning e-whatever grade in the long run on parts of the bike??

Running E85 would have no effect on the shroud around the exhaust. According to the site, the engine would run cooler, and theoretically have lower exhaust temps, so definitely not an issue.

 

[Eugene_sto]

I'm surprised that there's nothing stated about changing the fuel lines. I'd heard that E85 will eat standard lines.

You may want to do some more research before getting too far into this.

well if your car is about 20 years old then it might. BTW it was not a rumors about higher % of ethanol in all king of gasoline. Last month EPA approved 15% blend for cars made in 2000 and up...good new for the industry! All relatively new cars are ethanol compatible.

 

[Eugene_sto]

I've thought about this too and it really isnt that many changes.. only possibly hic-cup i thought of would be the stuff inside the tank.. fuel economy would decreas from say 35mpg to around what 32mpg.. 30mpg.. I know it would be a bit lower... to maximize this however, you would want to get some tuning software and have the bike dyno'd a few times.. with a proper tune, the bike would run at maximum mpg (with the proper rider of course)..

I have no knowledge on this part, but what about the exhaust system when running ethonol?? header, cat, and back to the muffler and (for those of us with stock) that plastic shroud?? what about people with leos, scorps and other aftermarket??? what is the effect of burning e-whatever grade in the long run on parts of the bike??

Thats the problem. No test were ever made or at least I never found any records. BUT there is one small 150cc Honda Titan made only for Brazilian market which can run on 100% ethanol or any lower blends. You can find it on official Honda's web site (Honda Brazil)

 

[Eugene_sto]

Thats the problem. No test were ever made or at least I never found any records. BUT there is one small 150cc Honda Titan made only for Brazilian market which can run on 100% ethanol or any lower blends. You can find it on official Honda's web site (Honda Brazil)

Here is English version