dirty oil after 3K miles

[razteo]

I changed the oil & the filter last night after exactly 3 months & 2800 miles and it was very dark brown - almost black.

I use Yamalube 10W-40 (non-synthetic) and I change it every 3 months or 3k miles, whichever come 1st.

The bike is in very good shape, 2006 with almost 14k miles on it, and I mainly use it for canyon ridings in weekends, nothing crazy, normal REVs, here in South California, warm & dry climate, engine temperature is always in the middle, no riding in dust, etc, so it shouldn't be any problem.

BUT I worry now after I saw that oil so dark - I am thinking to start doing the oil change more often now. I thought 3 months & 3k miles is more than reasonable.
I remember at the last oil change I also thought the oil was a bit darker that is should be IMO, but not as bad.

I don't want to open a can of worms (OIL CHANGE THREAT!), just my observation regarding the dirty oil.

Any thoughts?

 

[Motogiro]

Mine also gets really dark. I just changed oil and the brand/type of oil. It's probably fine. Keep in mind that the clutch and tranny share the same oil.

Where are you in SoCal? I'm in San Diego...

 

[Rumpole of the Bailey]

Gday Bloke,
I am on the Yamalube 15w 50 non-synthetic and change at 3000 km intervals as well. In my case about every month as I do a bit of riding.
I may change to Motul in the future. The oil isn't too bad at 3000km but I like to protect the engine and it gives me peace of mind. The dealer said 6000km intervals would be ok but I might wait until I use Motul Synthetic before I went to those extremes.

There has been a lot of opinion on the gearbox noise from Yamalube and my Yamaha dealer stocks and recommends Motul oil for my Fazer, but my opinion is that with all this Moto GP racing and development you would think Yamaha would be able to produce the best oil possible for their bikes?

So, being the 'Uncle Scrooge' that I am, I am sticking to Yamalube for the time being and the 3000km intervals.

Just my humble thoughts.
Bailey

 

[RJ2112]

Oil turns color mainly due to the 'blow by' of combustion gasses into the engine oil. If it doesn't smell burnt, isn't gritty when you rub it between your fingers, hasn't got any milky/cloudy sort of opaqueness it's doing it's job.

If you are concerned, send off a sample for analysis..... but it will almost certainly tell you that everything is fine.

 

[razteo]

Where are you in SoCal? I'm in San Diego...

I'm in LA.
I may change the oil type next time.

 

[razteo]

There has been a lot of opinion on the gearbox noise from Yamalube

I never had any noise on my bike.

 

[alanrim]

In UK our service interval and oil change is every 6000 miles, seems a lot but our bike does have a very large sump.

As we get a 2-year warranty here then I have to assume Yam are happy for the oil to stay in 6000 miles or 12-months.

 

[Wavex]

I'd be more worried if my oil wasn't dark brown/black after a few thousand miles!

+1 to RJ2112's post ^^^

 

[urbanj]

Oil turns color mainly due to the 'blow by' of combustion gasses into the engine oil. If it doesn't smell burnt, isn't gritty when you rub it between your fingers, hasn't got any milky/cloudy sort of opaqueness it's doing it's job.

If you are concerned, send off a sample for analysis..... but it will almost certainly tell you that everything is fine.

+1

if your oil is almost black at that mileage I'd be lead to think that you either have above average levels of blow by or maybe you are not riding hard enough when the engine is at rpm's that do not lead to good fuel mixing and more unburnt fuel. at the overall mileage the fuel injectors may be a little plugged and the spray pattern may be off leading to worse fuel atomization.

Long story short, I feel that at 2800 miles, it shouldn't be black. when was the last time you had a tune up? Have you done your spark plugs and airfilter? Also maybe a couple treatments of injector cleaner could help.

 

[Wavex]

The Dark Oil Myth
Dark oil does not indicate the need for an oil change. The way modern detergent motor oil works is that minute particles of soot are suspended in the oil. These minute particles pose no danger to your engine, but they cause the oil to darken. A non-detergent oil would stay clearer than a detergent oil because all the soot would be left on the internal engine parts and would create sludge. If you never changed your oil, eventually the oil would no longer be able to suspend any more particles in the oil and sludge would form. Fortunately, by following the manufacturer's recommended oil change interval, you are changing your oil long before the oil has become saturated. Remember, a good oil should get dirty as it does it's work cleaning out the engine. The dispersant should stop all the gunk from depositing in the oil pan.

The only real way to determine whether oil is truly in need of changing is to have an oil analysis performed. Since most people don't want to bother with this, it's acceptable to err heavily on the safe side and simply follow the manufacturer's recommended change interval for severe service. There are still a few cars that specify 3K intervals for severe service, but not many. If you look at countries other than the U.S., the oil recommended change interval is much higher than even the normal interval specified by vehicle manufacturers in the U.S.

 

[RJ2112]

+1

if your oil is almost black at that mileage I'd be lead to think that you either have above average levels of blow by or maybe you are not riding hard enough when the engine is at rpm's that do not lead to good fuel mixing and more unburnt fuel. at the overall mileage the fuel injectors may be a little plugged and the spray pattern may be off leading to worse fuel atomization.

Long story short, I feel that at 2800 miles, it shouldn't be black. when was the last time you had a tune up? Have you done your spark plugs and airfilter? Also maybe a couple treatments of injector cleaner could help.

Many short trips without letting the bike get to temperature will lead to excessive blow by... the ECU will run a 'rich' mixture; the rider romps on the gas when the rings/cylinders/valves aren't all the way warmed up, and a higher than 'normal' percentage of the fuel ends up in the oil.

The biggest bugaboo with this conversation is the huge range of perception on what 'black' oil looks like.

Oil should get dirty.... that's why it gets changed, before it becomes a problem for the motor. It's wasteful to change it earlier than needed.

 

[grumpy1luvs2eat]

Go WAVEX! I've always felt the oil was doing the job when dirty, GRUMPY

 

[razteo]

Bottom line

.. so the dark colored oil shouldn't be a problem.

Also, the oil is dark NOT because is "burnt", but because is doing its job & that's the way it should look.

So I should be fine keeping my maintenance routine, no need to change the oil more often, or the oil type.

Thank you guys.

PS: I had a full tune-up 3 months ago at the Yamaha dealer.

 

[zigzagg321]

I changed my oil the other day, its the second oil change the bike has had in its 4800 mile life so far and the oil that came out was very dirty, almost black. It didnt concern me though, cause after being a car mechanic for 12 years, nearly every car I have ever changed the oil on....the oil was black.

 

[deeptekkie]

Spoken well!

 

[FizzySix]

If it's dark, it's doing its job. Mine is as well. It's a good thing, unless it's excessive.

The 3mo/3k miles thing is no longer valid for most vehicles. It's perpetuated by oil-change franchises with their little windshield stickers to remind you to come back more frequently. Follow the manufacturer guidelines for your vehicle (applies to all vehicles, not just bikes). Unless you plan to keep it forever and ride this thing to your own funeral a gazillion miles from now, which is probably not the case.

 

[Rumpole of the Bailey]

Many short trips without letting the bike get to temperature will lead to excessive blow by... the ECU will run a 'rich' mixture; the rider romps on the gas when the rings/cylinders/valves aren't all the way warmed up, and a higher than 'normal' percentage of the fuel ends up in the oil.

The biggest bugaboo with this conversation is the huge range of perception on what 'black' oil looks like.

Oil should get dirty.... that's why it gets changed, before it becomes a problem for the motor. It's wasteful to change it earlier than needed.

I don't agree on it being wasteful. Changing the factory exhausts which are stainless steel and forking out $700 + for different ones is wasteful!!
By changing the oil at 3000km for me is a real advantage for the next person who buys my scoot. I rarely keep a bike more than a year.
Oil and fuel are the cheapest things that go into a bike.
No doubt my comment on the exhaust change will create a backlash of sentiment but in reality, I don't need more power or noise.
If I did, I would by an R1

Just my opinion.

 

[Gcontroller]

The factory service manual for my 06 FZ6 recommends oil change at 4000 miles and oil filter change at every other oil change or 8000 miles.

This is with regular non synthetic oil or Yamaha Lube something or other.

I change my oil around 3500 miles and change the filter at every change with an automotive oil filter. The automotive filter is longer with more filter element when compared to a Yamaha oil filter. And it's black so it matches my engine and frame.

The oil comes out dirty as it should. Fresh oil and filter and I am done. Costs me about $25 bucks total if that I buy the oil by the gallon. I do the work myself. No big deal. Oh and I use Rotella Synthetic. I get it and my filters from Walmart. Over 21,000 miles and the bike runs like new.

It's easy to get caught up in this oil or that oil is better. My point of view is a lot of that is marketing hype is driving that. What ever works for you is good. Just don't ever run low on oil.

 

[Kazza]

Gday Bloke,
I am on the Yamalube 15w 50 non-synthetic and change at 3000 km intervals as well. In my case about every month as I do a bit of riding.
I may change to Motul in the future. The oil isn't too bad at 3000km but I like to protect the engine and it gives me peace of mind. The dealer said 6000km intervals would be ok but I might wait until I use Motul Synthetic before I went to those extremes.

There has been a lot of opinion on the gearbox noise from Yamalube and my Yamaha dealer stocks and recommends Motul oil for my Fazer, but my opinion is that with all this Moto GP racing and development you would think Yamaha would be able to produce the best oil possible for their bikes?

So, being the 'Uncle Scrooge' that I am, I am sticking to Yamalube for the time being and the 3000km intervals.

Just my humble thoughts.
Bailey

I have a little noise from my gearbox too. It's running Yamalube but tomorrow we're dropping the oil in all the bikes and trying Motul Synthetic. Heard it's really good. We'll see.

 

[Gcontroller]

If it's dark, it's doing its job. Mine is as well. It's a good thing, unless it's excessive.

The 3mo/3k miles thing is no longer valid for most vehicles. It's perpetuated by oil-change franchises with their little windshield stickers to remind you to come back more frequently. Follow the manufacturer guidelines for your vehicle (applies to all vehicles, not just bikes). Unless you plan to keep it forever and ride this thing to your own funeral a gazillion miles from now, which is probably not the case.

It's not valid for the USA 06 FZ6 for sure. Per Yamaha Service Manual at 4000 miles change the oil at 8000 change the oil & filter. Do I do that? No I am a bit more conservative. 3500 miles and Blue gets fresh oil and filter every time for me.

I just can't see paying $10 a quart for oil when the manufacture isn't calling for it. Seems like overkill but better then killing your motor. What ever makes you happy and confident is up to the owner. And in the end that is what counts.