Dead FZ6 :(

[zixaq]

I'm getting ready to go get my bike towed home, but once I get it here I need to get it troubleshot and repaired quickly as it's my primary mode of transportation.

Long version:
My bike started to do a whining/whistling noise yesterday that increased with engine revs, reproducible on center stand. I needed to go meet a friend visiting from out of town, so I put the troubleshooting on hold and went to dinner. After dinner, bike started but had check engine light on. I turned it off and tried to restart it, and it did the typical super low battery symptoms of sadness. I bumpstarted it three times, but it wouldn't stay running, which makes me think the charging system is bad. Battery is an 18-month old shorai lithium, replaced at the same time as a bad stator last spring. I saw a reference to a whining noise being associated with a bum stator on a few other motors and wondered if anyone here had experienced similar things, and if there is anything that might explain a brand new stator crapping out in barely more than a year. (assuming that really is the issue. My multimeter is ready)

Does our bike have a crappy R/R that I should upgrade/replace?

Short version:
Bike doesn't start or stay running when bumpstarted
Whining noise pitch matched to revs started same day (related?)
Suspected bad stator, but stator replaced a year ago. Other things to check?

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Was the replaced stator OEM?

Sounds like you need to get the battery on a charger FIRST and get it running. (should have aprox 12.8 volts before testing.

Once charged, a multi meter to see if it's charging, etc.

Stators fail, not terribly often. Mine's 10 years old, been laid down on the stator case at least 3 times and works just fine..
Never touched the VR..

I'd be checking connections, VR, etc while the battery is charging..


I've heard automotive alternators sometimes whine when bad, can't comment on the bike

 

[zixaq]

Yeah, trying to find someone to loan me a charger while waiting for tow guy now.

 

[Motogiro]

Sometimes you get stator whine when the stator is under load. An example would be that whine you'll hear right after you start your car. The regulator sees the drop in voltage and kicks up the field winding on your alternator and you get the whine. As the voltage climbs the regulator backs off the field and the whine reduces.
Our bikes are a little different because the field is created by permanent magnets. There is no field regulation and shunting is generally the way regulation is accomplished on bikes.

Generally the FZ6 has a very reliable charging system although we often hear the complaint not enough headroom for accessories.
One thing different on your bike is the Lithium battery. I would imagine it's internal resistance would be close to a lead acid. I don't know the characteristic voltages on the battery you're using so I can only guess that it's very close to a lead acid.

As Scott has already said charge the battery and confirm you have good static voltage and then check charging voltage.

 

[zixaq]

Okay, so, I had to get a new multimeter and it's not very good, but:

Battery fully charged on a battery tender, reads about 12.8 ±.2 V

At idle after warmed up, and at 5k rpm, reading never moves much, never goes above 13 V, so charging system is messed up. Waiting for it to cool down now to check the stator. The whining noise really gets prevalent at about 6k. I'm betting on a bum stator.

I don't know if it's an OEM part or not. It was replaced under a 60-day warranty from the used dealer I bought it from. I'm a little over a year out from that and 20k miles on the part.

For replacement, the OEM bit is close to $300, and ebay has stator and RR sets for under $100. I know someone is going to say "you get what you pay for", but has anyone used the aftermarket parts? Cash is really tight right now and a 200 dollar difference is hard to swallow.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Okay, so, I had to get a new multimeter and it's not very good, but:

Battery fully charged on a battery tender, reads about 12.8 ±.2 V

At idle after warmed up, and at 5k rpm, reading never moves much, never goes above 13 V, so charging system is messed up. Waiting for it to cool down now to check the stator. The whining noise really gets prevalent at about 6k. I'm betting on a bum stator.

I don't know if it's an OEM part or not. It was replaced under a 60-day warranty from the used dealer I bought it from. I'm a little over a year out from that and 20k miles on the part.

For replacement, the OEM bit is close to $300, and ebay has stator and RR sets for under $100. I know someone is going to say "you get what you pay for", but has anyone used the aftermarket parts? Cash is really tight right now and a 200 dollar difference is hard to swallow.

I have $ that says that replacement IS AFTERMARKET, thus not much in the way of longevity...

I would look either here (for sale section) or Flea Bay for a used OEM stator and VR.

There's been several engines, bought and swapped recently, with very likely the parts you need.


If not, post a WTB in that section.

PM "Scooter65", he's usually got a bunch of bikes getting parted out

 

[zixaq]

If stator leads are A, B and C:

A-C resistance is right on the money
A-B and B-C both show infinite resistance. I'm on the hunt.

For the R/R: Anyone know what the resistances are supposed to read? All the directionality checks out, and I get 5 Ohms across each diode and 25 Ohms from Red to Black. The service manual has nothing. I'm guessing it's okay, but it would be nice to check the numbers against someone else.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

You need Cliff to chime in, I don't do electrons...
[MENTION=2579]Motogiro[/MENTION]

 

[gulfpete]

I have a stator you could have cheap but freight would kill the deal.

I've never done it myself but you could try this
http://www.600riders.com/forum/how-to-s-/37991-how-re-build-your-stator.html
You may even find a broken wire when you get it out.

 

[zixaq]

I have a stator you could have cheap but freight would kill the deal.

I've never done it myself but you could try this
http://www.600riders.com/forum/how-to-s-/37991-how-re-build-your-stator.html
You may even find a broken wire when you get it out.

Yeah, shipping overseas probably would. I might try rebuilding the old stator to have a spare, but after I get back from my trip next week I need the bike running ASAP and don't have time to mess something up.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Found one (DARIUS actually) , OEM and TESTED, POST #3:

http://www.600riders.com/forum/bikes-parts-wanted/57818-need-stator.html



And you have the E-Bay guarentee if it doesn't work right.



.

 

[Motogiro]

Here are 2 different videos on testing regulator/rectifier and testing the stator.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDx3zgOLShY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5v2LtHlvcqI

 

[Motogiro]

In addition you might source your stator through Rick's https://ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/
They have a good rep for as good or better quality than OEM at good pricing. I'm using a stator replacement from them for 2 years now and I'm happy with the performance.

Also both TowssendFJR13000 and FinalImpact continue to selflessly support this and other forums as well as members troubleshooting problems and spreading good will to all corners of the globe. Thank you Scott and Randy!

If you use that search window you will find a plethora great reads as we try to help people through solutions on this forum.

Randy has put together a great thread with additional technical knowledge and experience to help with most issues you may run into.
Check it out: http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-...ttery-charging-brake-bleeding.html#post579412

 

[zixaq]

Here are 2 different videos on testing regulator/rectifier and testing the stator.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDx3zgOLShY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5v2LtHlvcqI

Yep. Thanks, I've already done those tests, as stated. Our manual does not have specific values for the diode test and I was hoping to compare against someone else's measured values.

In addition you might source your stator through Rick's https://ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/
They have a good rep for as good or better quality than OEM at good pricing. I'm using a stator replacement from them for 2 years now and I'm happy with the performance.

I looked at Rick's already, but as far as I can tell, he only does stators for suzuki gsxr?

In any case, new (used) stator on the way.

 

[zixaq]

So I got back into town and got the new stator on, and it appears to be working okay. Unfortunately the stator came with some visible damage (chips off of the insulating material on the iron posts), but it checked out with a voltmeter and I need my bike back, so I mounted it and testing at the curb seems okay.

Also unfortunately, I still can't ride the damn thing because Murphy's Law kicked in and my rear tire was ultraflat when I came back and won't hold rideable pressure for more than an hour. Will change tire on Tuesday and hopefully get my transportation back.



Aside: I now have a burned out aftermarket stator on my hands. Is it worth having re-wrapped as a spare, or is there something fundamentally low-quality about the core and wiring on those that would make it not worth it?

 

[darius]

2 steps forward and another 2 back. I'd recommend tracking down the source of the leak.

If the rubber is old then consider changing the front as well. If not, depending on the cause of the leak and extent, sealant may be a good option.

 

[zixaq]

2 steps forward and another 2 back. I'd recommend tracking down the source of the leak.

If the rubber is old then consider changing the front as well. If not, depending on the cause of the leak and extent, sealant may be a good option.

The leak was from another nail. I'm really starting to wish I had saved a jar of all the crap I've pulled out of tires on this bike over the last two years. Anyway, this is the third plug in that tire and it probably only had another 1k miles on it anyway, so off it comes. Someday I want to wear out a tire without a puncture. I wonder what that's like.

 

[darius]

The leak was from another nail. I'm really starting to wish I had saved a jar of all the crap I've pulled out of tires on this bike over the last two years. Anyway, this is the third plug in that tire and it probably only had another 1k miles on it anyway, so off it comes. Someday I want to wear out a tire without a puncture. I wonder what that's like.

Yikes. Be sure to pick out a non-magnetic tire this time. But seriously, I'd recommend running sealant to guard against flats given how much crap is on your roads.