AdamFZ
Junior Member
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Broken my gears :-(
- Thread starter AdamFZ
- Start date
It's very easy to see the wear on the cog, is that from it jumpimg out of gear?
Sorry but my non mechanical brain is trying to work out which bits disengage with the clutch and which bits provide the drive.
I reckon I need to have a look at a microfiche.
Thanks for all the great pictures.
Neil:thumbup:
Sorry but my non mechanical brain is trying to work out which bits disengage with the clutch and which bits provide the drive.
I reckon I need to have a look at a microfiche.
Thanks for all the great pictures.
Neil:thumbup:
iSteve
Junior Member
Nelly, the clutch disengages the engine from the transmission. The only time the transmission disengages input to output shaft is in neutral or that fraction of a second between shifts. Sometimes a shift will get stuck (the drum doesn't turn far enough to completely move the forks) in between gears causing a false neutral.
AdamFZ
Junior Member
Those pictures are of all the gears that 2nd require.
FYI, the bike has done 27k miles so i expect this is normal wear and tear on the dogs.
I've got all genuine Yamaha parts ready to put it back together now.
FYI, the bike has done 27k miles so i expect this is normal wear and tear on the dogs.
I've got all genuine Yamaha parts ready to put it back together now.
What a wonderful explanation, thanks.
Our bikes are the same year and very similar mileage, Got a couple of questions?
Are you on the original clutch? How's the wear?
Where did you get the hand guards from (they look just the job).
What fairing screen are you using?
If you have a garage sale, I'll have whats on your freezer lol.
How doe's your number board work with the bolts?
I have made this thread a sticky as you have got so much info in it for anyone wanting to look at the bottom end. A great thread thanks for your contribution.
Neil
AdamFZ
Junior Member
As far as I know, its the original clutch. I need to measure the thickness of the plates.
They are Storm hand guards, came with the bike.
I got a Yamaha touring screen.
No lol, that's some booze for my wedding !
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
They are Storm hand guards, came with the bike.
I got a Yamaha touring screen.
No lol, that's some booze for my wedding !
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
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Great pictures, your very talented by BTW, thank you for the pic's of the heart of our FZ..
I think that's a very wise idea re new genuine Yamaha parts.
I do have second thoughts about that one shifter dog with the marks on it. As light as the marks are, the gear STILL SHOULD NOT HAVE TOUCHED the dog.
IMHO, as deep as you are, if you haven't already ordered that shifter dog, IMO, I would, even if its just slightly bent..
:thumbup:
RichBinAZ
Desert Dweller
Hi Adam
In the close-up of the shift fork there appears to be a second touch and these do look like very slight touches and probably wont show up on the gear that the shift fork has moved into. I was very surprized in my suzuki gearbox that the fork could be cut so badly and yet still be un-bent. This could happen any time you get stuck in a gear and stomp on the pedal to try and get it to shift. It isn't anywhere near severe enough to warrant replacing the shift fork
Well it does look as though 2nd has had a couple of harsh engagements, but the worn part on the dogs doesn't seem to extend beyond the chamfer that was originally manufactured all around the top of each dog.
There is a little bit of smearing across the webs between the windows on 2nd gear and a small amount of radiusing on the relatively sharp corners of the windows on that gear. It doesn't look like it would be enough to make it jump out of gear. The engagement marks on the flanks of the windows indicate that the dog engages about 75% of the way down - so i doubt if it would slip.
On my Suzuki gearbox, the slipping was quite pronounced. It couldn't handle any amount of power input without ratcheting.
I have to go back and read the whole post again and look at the other pictures.
I think it would be worthwhile to re-assembly both gearshafts, along with the shift forks, put it all back in the case and turn the parts to see if anything shows up. Specially when 2nd gear is selected.
Rich
So here's what is occuring to me
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
In short, i don't have an answer for the noise you are hearing in second gear, unless the noise is accompanied by a ratcheting feeling by the bike - which you didn't say you were getting.
Try the re-assembly and see if you can duplicate the noise somehow
In the close-up of the shift fork there appears to be a second touch and these do look like very slight touches and probably wont show up on the gear that the shift fork has moved into. I was very surprized in my suzuki gearbox that the fork could be cut so badly and yet still be un-bent. This could happen any time you get stuck in a gear and stomp on the pedal to try and get it to shift. It isn't anywhere near severe enough to warrant replacing the shift fork
Well it does look as though 2nd has had a couple of harsh engagements, but the worn part on the dogs doesn't seem to extend beyond the chamfer that was originally manufactured all around the top of each dog.
There is a little bit of smearing across the webs between the windows on 2nd gear and a small amount of radiusing on the relatively sharp corners of the windows on that gear. It doesn't look like it would be enough to make it jump out of gear. The engagement marks on the flanks of the windows indicate that the dog engages about 75% of the way down - so i doubt if it would slip.
On my Suzuki gearbox, the slipping was quite pronounced. It couldn't handle any amount of power input without ratcheting.
I have to go back and read the whole post again and look at the other pictures.
I think it would be worthwhile to re-assembly both gearshafts, along with the shift forks, put it all back in the case and turn the parts to see if anything shows up. Specially when 2nd gear is selected.
Rich
So here's what is occuring to me
In short, i don't have an answer for the noise you are hearing in second gear, unless the noise is accompanied by a ratcheting feeling by the bike - which you didn't say you were getting.
Try the re-assembly and see if you can duplicate the noise somehow
Last edited:
AdamFZ
Junior Member
Thank you all so much for the replies and advice :thumbup:
I started the rebuild today, reckon i'll have the engine back in the bike and running tomorrow. If the noise is still there them i'm just going to live with it as as far as i can see, nothing is wrong with the gears. If it breaks.... i'll get a 2nd hand engine.
I started the rebuild today, reckon i'll have the engine back in the bike and running tomorrow. If the noise is still there them i'm just going to live with it as as far as i can see, nothing is wrong with the gears. If it breaks.... i'll get a 2nd hand engine.
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Damn your fast!!
Very, very curious to see if the noise is gone as you did replace some parts, correct?
Very, very curious to see if the noise is gone as you did replace some parts, correct?
darius
Never stop exploring
You are hardcore. :rockon: Best of luck. I hope it's fixed up good now and thanks for sharing.
Better yet, how did you time the cams w/out taking the VC off? Unless you marked the chain and gear?? Hopefully throwing the block about didn't allow the chain off the cams.
I still vote the gear train is 100% but the shift mechanism is allowing something to contact. The tiniest amount of contact will make a huge noise. What is odd is straight cut gears don't walk like bevel cut helical gears as these change noise volume by the load imposed due to the angle cut.
RichBinAZ
Desert Dweller
Wow, I blinked and the engine is back together.
Did you get a chance to spin the gears to see if there was any noise when they were spinning in 2nd?
I also thought I saw something in one of your pictures so I made a comment here
[/IMG]
I would put the engine back into the frame before putting the clutch back together. One of the things you can do is pour a few pints of oil into the sump and spin the clutch shaft anti-clockwise - this should prime the engine passages with oil, so it isn't dry when you start it up. Then put the clutch back together.
On my suzuki, one of the clutch hub nuts takes a huge torque and some people have put the bike in the wrong gear to tighten the nut. If you use a wood block in the back wheel and the gearbox in either 5th or 6th, that should work - unless you have the official tool to stop the basket rotating.
I suspect the next picture will show you wheelying down the street
Did you get a chance to spin the gears to see if there was any noise when they were spinning in 2nd?
I also thought I saw something in one of your pictures so I made a comment here
I would put the engine back into the frame before putting the clutch back together. One of the things you can do is pour a few pints of oil into the sump and spin the clutch shaft anti-clockwise - this should prime the engine passages with oil, so it isn't dry when you start it up. Then put the clutch back together.
On my suzuki, one of the clutch hub nuts takes a huge torque and some people have put the bike in the wrong gear to tighten the nut. If you use a wood block in the back wheel and the gearbox in either 5th or 6th, that should work - unless you have the official tool to stop the basket rotating.
I suspect the next picture will show you wheelying down the street
RichBinAZ
Desert Dweller
He never touched the cams and crankshaft, so it should all be fine - though this would be a good time to check the valve clearances. Access is prime right now.
Straight cut gears should not produce end thrust, but on my bonneville, the clearance at the clutch lever in 3rd gear under power is minimal, put it in decel mode and the gap gets bigger. So there must be a thrust there - shouldn't be, but there is. It's probably due to clearances between the gears and shafts.
Spinning the gears in place would have been a good check to see if the gears were touching anything as they typically don't miss the housing by much - or each other.
^^ looked back at pic, true Never apart. I thought I saw the CAM chain slack. It wasn't. Anyways, time will tell I guess.
AdamFZ
Junior Member
There was no anti-rotation pin in that bearing.
I spun the gears in all gears and i can't hear a noise.... maybe i'm not spinning it enough. I suppose it needs more of load through the gears as that is when it made the grinding sound.
I'll try and get a video of it
Thanks again guys !
I spun the gears in all gears and i can't hear a noise.... maybe i'm not spinning it enough. I suppose it needs more of load through the gears as that is when it made the grinding sound.
I'll try and get a video of it
Thanks again guys !
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GOOD LUCK as you'll likely have it running today (fingers crossed)!!!:thumbup:
AdamFZ
Junior Member
Evening all !
Today i drilled out and tapped the 1 and only header stud, check the valve clearances and all are within range. I got the engine all back together and back in the bike. Connected everything up, filled up with oil and coolant.... 1st turn over and she's purring like a kitten :thumbup:
Only problem is...... the noise is still there
I've got a video of it from both sides of the bike.
Right side.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb9i6lW3a2Y]Gear_Noise_right_side - YouTube[/ame] (ignore the clunking... that's the chain slap
Left side.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8MpN5DMKAs]Gear_Noise_left_side - YouTube[/ame]
Oh and its doing it coasting in 2nd gear when the clutch is pulled in as well
I'm starting to think its a bearing ??
Today i drilled out and tapped the 1 and only header stud, check the valve clearances and all are within range. I got the engine all back together and back in the bike. Connected everything up, filled up with oil and coolant.... 1st turn over and she's purring like a kitten :thumbup:
Only problem is...... the noise is still there
I've got a video of it from both sides of the bike.
Right side.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb9i6lW3a2Y]Gear_Noise_right_side - YouTube[/ame] (ignore the clunking... that's the chain slap
Left side.... [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8MpN5DMKAs]Gear_Noise_left_side - YouTube[/ame]
Oh and its doing it coasting in 2nd gear when the clutch is pulled in as well
I'm starting to think its a bearing ??
