Rode through a flood. Have I killed my engine?

[Marthy]

I did the same thing with my old cage few years ago... If you did blow your engine because of riding in water you would have know... We call that hydro-lock! It was pretty ugly... I sheared 11 connecting rod in half and bend the other 3.

Pull the tank off and clean & lube everything. Should be fine.

 

[FZ09Bandit]

Pistons cannot combust water, you might as well try to crush a rock lol.

 

[FinalImpact]

Okay. So at the weekend, I took off the tank, airbox etc. I took out the filter and it was dry and clean (the bike was serviced in November). I noticed that the pipe circled wasn't connected to the airbox and it definitely was last time I had the airbox off. Probably those naughty mechanics who serviced the bike didn't plug it on again or it dropped down after not being fastened tight enough. I cleaned and sprayed WD-40 all over the place including into the engine through the air intakes. I also sprayed it over where any pipes went. I checked all the pipes going into the airbox. I left the battery disconnected during the whole time and this may have had an impact too.

I checked the throttle action and it seems fine, but I sprayed more WD40 over both ends anyway. The gold throttle valve thingies shown in the picture were closed and airtight with no throttle anyway as they held a few ml WD-40 fine until I twisted the throttle!

I didn't bother checking the spark plugs yet as the Haynes manual told me I needed to remove and drain the whole cooling system to get to them and I didn't have the time or motivation to do this!!! :spank:

When running, I couldn't feel or hear any obvious exhaust leaks.

When I put the bike back together, it was still running rough and idling high. I used the idle adjust screw and managed to get it down to about 1.1k idle. It was blowing either white smoke or steam out of the exhaust at first, but this went away after running it for 10 mins or so. The next morning the smoke/condensation was back and it was still sounding rough. It actually reminded me a lot of an MT-01 I rode once! The annoying thing is that the bike is fine as soon as I start But as soon as I stop it sounds horrible at idle again. I'll take a video tonight and upload. I may have to take it to a garage as I've done no engine work at all before and don't want to make anything worse!

So in summary: it's better than before, but there is still something wrong!

I can see the crank case breather being off making it louder as the throttle bodies "suckin wind" are now exposed to you and the greater outdoors. Should not effect idle. Just sound from the bike.

Did you look over all of the hoses? I still think there is a vacuum leak.

 

[FinalImpact]

Pistons cannot combust water, you might as well try to crush a rock lol.

When I used to race the Kawi 650 SX stand up Jet Ski, doing subs and stuff like that, I can't believe i never trashed that engine. It sucked water many times while going under logs and stuff. What's funny is running 2 bilge pumps plus the OEM factory one, it was BAD IDEA to do a sub with them on as they moved so much water volume it literally sucked in more water faster. Actually defeating the purpose. So for doing sub type dives, leave the electric bilge off, flip on once above the water.
Wish they would have had GoPro then....

/end thread derail

 

[SANGER_A2]

I've uploaded a video here of it running when warm. If I have time tomorrow morning I can film it when cold.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3YveZDa6kQ]2008 FZ6 ABS Running Rough - YouTube[/ame]
I'm pleased that I can get to the plugs without draining the radiator. Of course it will be a PITA with my full fairing so I'll have to leave it until the weekend.

I checked all the hoses the connect to the airbox and they are all on solid. I suppose one could have developed a leak, but I can't really check that when the bike is running as I'd have to have the tank in the air.

 

[FZ09Bandit]

When I used to race the Kawi 650 SX stand up Jet Ski, doing subs and stuff like that, I can't believe i never trashed that engine. It sucked water many times while going under logs and stuff. What's funny is running 2 bilge pumps plus the OEM factory one, it was BAD IDEA to do a sub with them on as they moved so much water volume it literally sucked in more water faster. Actually defeating the purpose. So for doing sub type dives, leave the electric bilge off, flip on once above the water.
Wish they would have had GoPro then....

/end thread derail

How many pumps? Three? If you dilute it enough yes. Doesn't mean it was the best thing for it, or the cylinder walls either.

 

[Motogiro]

Sound like a misfire on at least one cylinder. Pull the spark plug wires and blow out the holes completely to eliminate any water or debri then remove plugs.

 

[SANGER_A2]

Pull the spark plug wires and blow out the holes completely to eliminate any water or debris

Thanks. What would I use to do this?

 

[yamihoe]

maybe a spark plug cap is loose or something?

is it possible that there is still some water on some of the sensors on the bottom side of the bike? I dont remember if there is a O2 on that year or not, but for that as well as the crank sensor, etc the ecu would throw a code (hopefully)

or maybe its totally unrelated and the cct is bad Blah

 

[FinalImpact]

I must admit this is a bizarre problem. Well at least the initiation and how it began.

Just throwing this out there;
Lets say the engine needs to make roughly 4 hp to idle. Loosing 1 cylinder from bad plug or wire would likely leave it down to three plus horsepower (dead hole is now like a air compressor = drag). Thus, its not likely to raise the RPM from being down a cylinder. Plus it smooths out and seems to get more normal as the RPM goes up (said initial post). That seems like a hint that its not ignition misfire.
If it were Throttle by Wire (TBW) and had misfire, its possible the computer would try to compensate and raise the RPM. But it doesn't have TBW and ECM IS NOT capable of any of that. From this, I circle back to find the vacuum leak and its likely you find your problem.

Try this; a long tube even like a paper towel tube placed up to the ear gives you directional sound tracking so you can pin point where sounds are coming from. Its helpful for finding vacuum leaks and other sounds on the outside of the engine.

As mentioned tho - there is merit in pulling the plugs as it may give a clue as to which cylinders are impacted (burn color of plugs). Did you find the ends of each TB sync port hose? Any chance a one of those plugs came out? TB sync recently??


EDIT: just now watched video. So this is after you played with the idle speed? As in, you lowered the rpm from what it was?

 

[Motogiro]

FinalImpact mentioned in post #6 to check the TPS. If you haven't done it yet you'll have to get your readout in diagnostic mode and get it to the section that looks at your TPS (Throttle Position Sensor)

Here's a link and the 1st post has instructions to get into and test the TPS through diagnostic mode.
http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-...ou-experiencing-poor-idle-mileage-stalls.html

Doesn't hurt to look at this and rule it out because TPS units fail everyday and are not just a recall item.

 

[FinalImpact]

FinalImpact mentioned in post #6 to check the TPS. If you haven't done it yet you'll have to get your readout in diagnostic mode and get it to the section that looks at your TPS (Throttle Position Sensor)

Here's a link and the 1st post has instructions to get into and test the TPS through diagnostic mode.
Vhttp://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-technical/181-throttle-position-sensor-issues-you-experiencing-poor-idle-mileage-stalls.html

Doesn't hurt to look at this and rule it out because TPS units fail everyday and are not just a recall item.

On this note; how clean was the water?? Going abstract, but disconnect the battery and remove the air box. Maybe its worth pulling apart all of the connections and examining them??

 

[SANGER_A2]

I must admit this is a bizarre problem. Well at least the initiation and how it began.

Just throwing this out there;
Lets say the engine needs to make roughly 4 hp to idle. Loosing 1 cylinder from bad plug or wire would likely leave it down to three plus horsepower (dead hole is now like a air compressor = drag). Thus, its not likely to raise the RPM from being down a cylinder. Plus it smooths out and seems to get more normal as the RPM goes up (said initial post). That seems like a hint that its not ignition misfire.
If it were Throttle by Wire (TBW) and had misfire, its possible the computer would try to compensate and raise the RPM. But it doesn't have TBW and ECM IS NOT capable of any of that. From this, I circle back to find the vacuum leak and its likely you find your problem.

Try this; a long tube even like a paper towel tube placed up to the ear gives you directional sound tracking so you can pin point where sounds are coming from. Its helpful for finding vacuum leaks and other sounds on the outside of the engine.

As mentioned tho - there is merit in pulling the plugs as it may give a clue as to which cylinders are impacted (burn color of plugs). Did you find the ends of each TB sync port hose? Any chance a one of those plugs came out? TB sync recently??


EDIT: just now watched video. So this is after you played with the idle speed? As in, you lowered the rpm from what it was?

It had it's major service at 16k miles. I assume they synced the throttle bodies then. It's two or three years since then. I don't know what TB sync port hoses are I'm afraid. I've messed around with my bike, but not really done any proper engine work other than changing the oil! It was much easier to change plugs etc on my last too bikes. Now everything is a PITA to get to.

Yup. That's after I turned it down. It sounds rougher now it's at 1000rpm, but at least I don't worry about the engine overheating in traffic.

Incidentally, I realised today that it runs at about 75c now on the motorway instead of 80-90c. Could this be because it's only running from three cylinders instead of 4 and so not heating up as much?

 

[SANGER_A2]

On this note; how clean was the water?? Going abstract, but disconnect the battery and remove the air box. Maybe its worth pulling apart all of the connections and examining them??

I disconnected the battery and sprayed the two main connections to it and took off and cleaned the airbox (not that it was dirty).

 

[FinalImpact]

Top of the pic; see those small hoses coming from the base of the Throttle bodies? There is one for each TB. They usually pair off, two on one side and two on the other. Each SHOULD have a plug in it to seal the end of it.

Follow them and confirm each is plugged.
HERE: See the GREEN Connector, see the WHITE connector, to the right of these two connectors is a hose. On the end of that hose is a plug. The hose has a pink stripe on it. That is what your looking for! THere are FOUR of them. Notice straight across on the other side (TOP OF PHOTO) is another that is visible.

But, the goal here is to FOLLOW EVERY hose and confirm its not sucking air some where. Hence the TUBE to the EAR. At idle you may be able to hear a vacuum leak.

Then, check these - make sure they are tight:

 

[SANGER_A2]

Thanks very much for all the tips guys. Incidentally, what noise should I be listening for?

Sent from my GT-P5110 using Tapatalk

 

[FinalImpact]

Something snake like - "hissing" Blah

The sound of vacuum leak is a suction like sound that I will make no attempt at describing!

 

[Powerman]

While you have your tank up, check the primary and secondary connections to the 2 ignition coils. Possibly got water up there. As others have mentioned, you need to pull the plugs to get a good visual of whats going on. A plug wet with fuel is not firing. Plugs that are too light in color are running lean which is probably a vacuum leak. If you have an infrared temp gun, shoot it on the headers individually the same distance from the head to see if any cylinders are running cool.

 

[deeptekkie]

I'm likely grasping straws here but on my '09 there is a sensor mounted in the exhaust, (but very low on the bike). Could you not have fried this sensor and now it's telling the computer all sorts of funky things? Just a thought....
Good luck!

 

[FinalImpact]

[MENTION=5263]SANGER_A2[/MENTION] this should give an idea of the hose ends which need tracked down.

Green is coolant - all other colors are suspect including the clamps at the throttle body base (not shown in this picture but is above in photo). The blue indicates components that could possible crack. Unlikely, but worthy of inspection IMO.

Parts by name and PN: Yamaha FZ6 07 Full parts catalog | Joisey Boyz Gastronomical Society

Again - thanks to [MENTION=7496]Erci[/MENTION]

Added Tag: JJD952 TB Sync