Yamaha to buy Buell?

[kevlarian]

<two cents>

I was actually looking at an XB9, but I heard reports that as a daily commuter (what I use my bike for) it was unacceptable. IDK. Maybe it would have made a good daily ride. Never-the-less, I am not going to get one now. Sorry Buell. Should have gone with a more modern V-Twin (Ducati, Aprilia, etc.) and not stuck with that friggin tank of an engine from Harley. Imagine a nice slender Aprilia 750 or 850 v-twin under the hood of one of those beauties... I would have bought one a long time ago.. I love the look of the XB series.

</two cents>

 

[Wavex]

Strickly from a tech stand point and this is HD as a whole, (Buell is thrown in the mix) You buy something for the name when you buy a HD. Same reason you'd buy a Porche, MB, BMW etc. now the difference is those auto companies are on the LEADING edge of technology. Would you buy 2010 aircooled Porche right here and now without ABS T/C etc. just because it's Porche.

People are learning. Now with the economy the way it is people are saying "I can get so much more for less."

A sportbikes using a aircooled OHV engines. give me a break. That's like right now you go out and buy a brand new car, spend a pretty penny and it doesnt have DOHC's, variable valve and ignition timing etc. Makes poor power and get poor economy vs. the vehicles it's competing with.

In this economic climate, a "brand name" only goes so far. Take at a look at what Hyundai is doing........

So you're saying Buell went down because their engines don't compete with the Jap bikes and because ppl buy Buells for the name brand?

lol yeah sure... you could not be further away from the truth imho...

 

[Wavex]

<two cents>

I was actually looking at an XB9, but I heard reports that as a daily commuter (what I use my bike for) it was unacceptable. IDK. Maybe it would have made a good daily ride. Never-the-less, I am not going to get one now. Sorry Buell. Should have gone with a more modern V-Twin (Ducati, Aprilia, etc.) and not stuck with that friggin tank of an engine from Harley. Imagine a nice slender Aprilia 750 or 850 v-twin under the hood of one of those beauties... I would have bought one a long time ago.. I love the look of the XB series.

</two cents>

I know I sound defensive, but I don't really care Do you still have access to these "reports" you talk about? The XB9Sx City is a PERFECT commuter imo!!

http://www.cycleworld.com/article.asp?section_id=42&article_id=55
http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/the-bteam-value-supersport-shootout-2005-14282.htm

And again the engine remarks What's wrong with the air cooled Harley engine? I am being serious, I really wonder what is wrong with that engine? I keep asking the question and other than "it's old" NO-ONE can explain to me why it sucks so much...

All I see from my stand point regarding the "tank engine" is:
- it has the same fuel economy as the FZ6 engine,
- it's a tank so naturally it has double the torque of the FZ6 engine,
- it's got 10 more HP than the FZ6 engine,
- The tank has self-adjusting valves (as in no adjustment EVER)... not the case on the FZ6,
- I don't have to carry the extra weight/uglyness associated with the water cooling system,
- it is indeed slower in top speed with max 140mph (speedo on my bike) as opposed to 150mph (speedo FZ6), but for a commuter, that should be fine

What am I missing?

 

[Motogiro]

I know I sound defensive, but I don't really care Do you still have access to these "reports" you talk about? The XB9Sx City is a PERFECT commuter imo!!

And again the engine remarks What's wrong with the air cooled Harley engine? I am being serious, I really wonder what is wrong with that engine? I keep asking the question and other than "it's old" NO-ONE can explain to me why it sucks so much...

All I see from my stand point is:
- same fuel economy as the FZ6 engine,
- double the torque of the FZ6 engine,
- 10 HP more than the FZ6 engine,
- Self-adjusting valves on the Buell (no adjustment EVER)... not the case on the FZ6,
- it is indeed slower in top speed with max 140mph (speedo on my bike) as opposed to 150mph (speedo FZ6), but for a commuter, that should be fine

What am I missing?

Yeah! and he's going to let me take it for a spin the next time we meet up for a ride! LOL! Hahaha

Love that bike! Got nothing negative to say about it....Well maybe that funny see through gas tank that always looks empty! LOL...

Really have to give props after having Dave & Buell on my butt going down Banner grade at a very decent clip. Then toasting it up Montezuma Vally Rd. back up the mountain. Amazing, rideable, artwork!

 

[Wavex]

Now that it's a collector, you want to ride it huh? lol

Thanks for the good words Cliff... I really need a ride lately... haven't been out on a "day ride" since our ride in early September! Gotta get out Sat. morning if I want to keep my sanity

About this discussion above, we all have our preferences, and I can totally understand if ppl want the latest and most advanced technology out there on their own bike, but to me, it is pretty obvious that most ppl don't know anything about Buell but the fact that they're owned by Harley, and that their Lightning series use an old Harley push-rod engine, and that's enough for them to disregard the whole brand as a whole under the excuse that "it's Harley, so it sucks"... (even though half their line up uses an amazing Rotax liquid cooled v-twin).

To me, Buell used to make awesome street motorcycles... they're not the fastest in a straight line, they're not the sharpest, they're not the most technologically advanced, they're not the most precise around corners, they're not the most reliable (even though I would argue that they're just as reliable as any other brand today) etc etc, but they're SUPER FUN to ride! Isn't that what it's all about?

 

[Hellgate]

Strickly from a tech stand point and this is HD as a whole, (Buell is thrown in the mix) You buy something for the name when you buy a HD. Same reason you'd buy a Porche, MB, BMW etc. now the difference is those auto companies are on the LEADING edge of technology. Would you buy 2010 aircooled Porche right here and now without ABS T/C etc. just because it's Porche.

Urban - Have you driven an air cooled Porsche with no ABS, etc? It is perhaps the most pure driving experiance in the world. I've owned several over the years and my air cooled cars were my favorite. Don't get me wrong my '02 Carrera was very fast but my tricked out '87 Carrera was much more fun and made the coolest sounds.

The RS America is perhaps a "perfect" car. If I could buy a new one today I would consider it and so would a large number of P-Car drivers, but not the Boxster drivers, because those really aren't Porsches.

 

[Motogiro]

Now that it's a collector, you want to ride it huh? lol

Thanks for the good words Cliff... I really need a ride lately... haven't been out on a "day ride" since our ride in early September! Gotta get out Sat. morning if I want to keep my sanity

About this discussion above, we all have our preferences, and I can totally understand if ppl want the latest and most advanced technology out there on their own bike, but to me, it is pretty obvious that most ppl don't know anything about Buell but the fact that they're owned by Harley, and that their Lightning series use an old Harley push-rod engine, and that's enough for them to disregard the whole brand as a whole under the excuse that "it's Harley, so it sucks"... (even though half their line up uses an amazing Rotax liquid cooled v-twin).

To me, Buell used to make awesome street motorcycles... they're not the fastest in a straight line, they're not the sharpest, they're not the most technologically advanced, they're not the most precise around corners, they're not the most reliable (even though I would argue that they're just as reliable as any other brand today) etc etc, but they're SUPER FUN to ride! Isn't that what it's all about?

Not only that it's super fun but that you're happy. I mean you know what you have and that's the important part.

In reference to a ride,check this out. http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-videos/24881-idyllwild.html

 

[Wavex]

BTW, the latest I heard:

XB9's, XB-X's and XB-XT's have a $3000 factory rebate.
XB12's have a $4000 rebate.
1125's have a $5000 rebate.

Some dude just bought this

for less than $7k OTD!!!!! :drool:

 

[Wavex]

oh and I wanted to add something as well:







:rof:



oh and here's a good read for those interested... http://www.2wf.com/content/view/3012/44/

 

[wrightme43]

I would ride the piss out of a Buell.

It would be good if they were purchased and continued on though. I would really like to see his take on a 4 cyl inline or 4 cyl V design.

 

[C-bus Biker]

I would ride the piss out of a Buell.

It would be good if they were purchased and continued on though. I would really like to see his take on a 4 cyl inline or 4 cyl V design.

Your signature is FANTASTIC!

 

[Wavex]

I just read this over on Cycle Canada:

Following Harley-Davidson's shock announcement last week that their Buell Motorcycle division is to be shuttered, a group of American businessmen from the area surrounding Buell headquarters in East Troy, Wisconsin is looking at taking over the company and keeping the local motorcycle factory open.

According to an economic development alliance news release, the Walworth County Economic Development Alliance has formed a team of officials from the Village of East Troy, Walworth County Board and East Troy Chamber of Commerce. The team plans to meet with company founder Erik Buell to learn about the company’s options and evaluate what can be done to continue production and save the jobs of its 170 employees.
http://www.passionperformance.ca/motorcycle/articles/5900/

Then I just happened to read this over on Clubchopper.com:

I can give you a inside scoop from a reliable source that Erik Buell is up in Canada as we chat trying to convince BRP to enter the two wheel market, or allow Buell to use the dealer network. We will see if the Bombardier Family, and Erik Buell can make a deal .
* I know everyone here thinks Harley is God but BRP is in markets Harley only dreamed of.
Buell will out live Harley if they team with BRP.
Would it not be funny if in lets say Erik Buell comes out with a Rotax Touring bike, and sinks Harley Davidson.



I hope at least some of this is true and Erik will find a way to sever his ties to HD.

 

[Wavex]

Harley paying dealers $5,000 for every Buell sold - Hell For Leather

 

[Hellgate]

I just read this over on Cycle Canada:

Following Harley-Davidson's shock announcement last week that their Buell Motorcycle division is to be shuttered, a group of American businessmen from the area surrounding Buell headquarters in East Troy, Wisconsin is looking at taking over the company and keeping the local motorcycle factory open.

According to an economic development alliance news release, the Walworth County Economic Development Alliance has formed a team of officials from the Village of East Troy, Walworth County Board and East Troy Chamber of Commerce. The team plans to meet with company founder Erik Buell to learn about the company’s options and evaluate what can be done to continue production and save the jobs of its 170 employees.
Possible Buell Takeover Bid in the Works - Motorcycle

Then I just happened to read this over on Clubchopper.com:

I can give you a inside scoop from a reliable source that Erik Buell is up in Canada as we chat trying to convince BRP to enter the two wheel market, or allow Buell to use the dealer network. We will see if the Bombardier Family, and Erik Buell can make a deal .
* I know everyone here thinks Harley is God but BRP is in markets Harley only dreamed of.
Buell will out live Harley if they team with BRP.
Would it not be funny if in lets say Erik Buell comes out with a Rotax Touring bike, and sinks Harley Davidson.



I hope at least some of this is true and Erik will find a way to sever his ties to HD.

I'e heard those rumblings too. BRP, Bombardier Recreation Products; nee: Ski Doo, Sea-Doo, Can-Am, Evinrude/Johnson and ROTAX.

If this comes to pass can you imagine the amazing motorcycles we'll see???

I'd guess the 1125 becomes and 1198, the cheap switch gear is gone and the cheap finishes are no more.

I know Court and company have been very busy the last week, I hope this plays out. :thumbup:

 

[urbanj]

Urban - Have you driven an air cooled Porsche with no ABS, etc? It is perhaps the most pure driving experiance in the world. I've owned several over the years and my air cooled cars were my favorite. Don't get me wrong my '02 Carrera was very fast but my tricked out '87 Carrera was much more fun and made the coolest sounds.

The RS America is perhaps a "perfect" car. If I could buy a new one today I would consider it and so would a large number of P-Car drivers, but not the Boxster drivers, because those really aren't Porsches.

A lot of vehicles from the past are great. My point is that if you were to by a 2010MY with the tech of a 2002MY you'd be very behind. A lot changes in even 8 years let alone decades.

So you're saying Buell went down because their engines don't compete with the Jap bikes and because ppl buy Buells for the name brand?

lol yeah sure... you could not be further away from the truth imho...

No but it's the same reason why people don't give love for the FZ6. It's not perceived as cool. Same as Buell. MOST of the public see it as a silly sport Harley with a Harley engine. Remember those Isuzu Impulses. IIRC their suspension was tuned by Lotus. It had a badge and all. That didn't make the car more appealing.

Most of the reasons people buy HD is the image. Now those same customers wouldn't be seen on a sports bike. There are always fan boys but you have to appeal and market to a broader range of people.

 

[Hellgate]

A lot of vehicles from the past are great. My point is that if you were to by a 2010MY with the tech of a 2002MY you'd be very behind. A lot changes in even 8 years let alone decades.



No but it's the same reason why people don't give love for the FZ6. It's not perceived as cool. Same as Buell. MOST of the public see it as a silly sport Harley with a Harley engine. Remember those Isuzu Impulses. IIRC their suspension was tuned by Lotus. It had a badge and all. That didn't make the car more appealing.

Most of the reasons people buy HD is the image. Now those same customers wouldn't be seen on a sports bike. There are always fan boys but you have to appeal and market to a broader range of people.

But IF Porsche was to make a current technology aircooled car today, it would be amazing.

Isuzus are ugly, and that fact has not helped Buell at all. When they do ugly they do it right! They need to hire some Italians to in the design department.

 

[Wavex]

A lot of vehicles from the past are great. My point is that if you were to by a 2010MY with the tech of a 2002MY you'd be very behind. A lot changes in even 8 years let alone decades.



No but it's the same reason why people don't give love for the FZ6. It's not perceived as cool. Same as Buell. MOST of the public see it as a silly sport Harley with a Harley engine. Remember those Isuzu Impulses. IIRC their suspension was tuned by Lotus. It had a badge and all. That didn't make the car more appealing.

Most of the reasons people buy HD is the image. Now those same customers wouldn't be seen on a sports bike. There are always fan boys but you have to appeal and market to a broader range of people.

Everywhere I go, there will usually be a guy or 3 who start looking at my Buell, and almost everybody's comment is "wow, that's cool!", but you are right... the majority of ppl interested in sportbikes don't even look at Buell since they're associated with HD, and sportbike + HD = no-no...

On top of that you have HD who never even tried to sell them...

So with that combo, Buell was in a tough spot....

 

[CrazyBiker]

I love Buells and it pains me to see them go. But if some maker with some sense aquires them, big things are in store for Buell. Dump those harley engines like harley dumped buell. Take all those engines and dump them in front of HD headquarters. Put the 1125 rotax in all of them. I will be the 1st one to run to buy them.

Now I am so much tempted to buy a XB12R brand new.

 

[Hellgate]

I love Buells and it pains me to see them go. But if some maker with some sense aquires them, big things are in store for Buell. Dump those harley engines like harley dumped buell. Take all those engines and dump them in front of buell headquarters. Put the 1125 rotax in all of them. I will be the 1st one to run to buy them.

Now I am so much tempted to buy a XB12R brand new.

You can right now, $6500 OTD on new '09 CRs.

 

[urbanj]

I love Buells and it pains me to see them go. But if some maker with some sense aquires them, big things are in store for Buell. Dump those harley engines like harley dumped buell. Take all those engines and dump them in front of HD headquarters. Put the 1125 rotax in all of them. I will be the 1st one to run to buy them.

Now I am so much tempted to buy a XB12R brand new.

I like the bikes and like you said, fix the drivetrain portion of the entire lineup and ditch the negative HD image and you have a winner.

Adding a powertrain combo to the "trilogy of tech" that Buell is good at and you have one hell of a bike.