WTF is up with Cycling Groups??

[Boneman]

The irony of this thread is that we as motorcyclists bitch about dumbass cagers all the time. Yet when the shoe is on the other foot...

Oh I fully realize the irony here :thumbup: Difference is we can at least do the speed limit in a group.

 

[interactive3]

I get annoyed with cyclists where I live because we have a dedicated network of cycle paths in the town.

They run alongside every main road in the town making riding safer in the town.

Do they use them? What do you think?

Unfortunately "Bike Paths" are really multi-use paths, with walkers, rollerbladers, kids learning to ride/skate, strollers/prams, etc. People are on both sides of the path making it dangerous when fast moving cyclists are there too. It's a great place for a leisurely ride at maybe 10mph or lower, but It's no place for a road bike riding at 20mph.

On a roadway cyclists are on the same side of the road and follow the same set of rules for yielding and right of way as motor vehicles. That helps to some extent.

I have observed one car seriously rear end another because the car in front stopped at crosswalk to allow an approaching cyclist to cross the roadway. It was a bad situation. I can understand how the guy in back was unprepared for the car in front to stop. There wasn't any "traffic" in the way, only a cyclist approaching. It isn't legal for cyclists to use sidewalks and crosswalks because of the confusion it would cause, or as in this case, the accidents it would cause.

I can understand why cyclists have to use the road and not pedestrian walkways (sidewalks/crosswalks). Cars would need to yield to cyclist "pedestrians" as they fly into crosswalks. What driver would be prepared for a pedestrian traveling at 20mph?

 

[Unseen]

Hehe you guys are not very used to bicycles. They are everywhere here in Holland. (And bikes in the cities here usually run lights and that kind of things). What's that fuss about spandex cycling gear? It's just comfortable if you're on a racing bike doing more than just cruising to the shops.

The general problem is that people in large groups always tend to claim more rights, space etc. It's not just cyclists, it's also biker groups or football fans etc.

 

[alanrim]

Unfortunately "Bike Paths" are really multi-use paths, with walkers, rollerbladers, kids learning to ride/skate, strollers/prams, etc. People are on both sides of the path making it dangerous when fast moving cyclists are there too. It's a great place for a leisurely ride at maybe 10mph or lower, but It's no place for a road bike riding at 20mph.

In UK often cycle paths are segregated from normal paths, and are just that cycle paths.

 

[interactive3]

First off, I'm glad that there's a reasonable tone in this thread, it's reassuring to me that our forum community manages, even in the context of what started as a rant, can have an intelligent discussion without sniping and attacking.

There are fools/tools on the road -- riding bicycles, riding motos, driving cars, hell, even walking. By their actions, they certainly don't earn our respect. And I know I'm as guilty as any when it comes to letting some bozo know how I don't approve...

But what concerns me about a thread like this, is that they feed into the running, internal dialogues we all keep within ourselves. Yeah, we all see folks acting stupid, and yeah, we don't like it. Got it. But when we rant and lump others, we allow a potentially hurtful mindset to persist and fester. And the next thing you know, someone's using their car to plow into a pack of cyclists.

There was an incident here in the East Bay area back in the early nineties where a woman went nuts and plowed into a group ride. To this day, I see one of the guys who was hit that day -- he's lucky as he survived, I think two or three others weren't so fortunate. He's got a prosthetic foot and still rides.

I guess I'm trying to suggest a "live and let live" and "do unto others" notions really do go a long way.

If you see cyclists -- solo or a group -- up the road, give a toot on the horn from a distance. I'm with Pete, if I get honked at by a vehicle when they're right next to me, I'm not too happy about that. If I hear a toot from a distant, approaching car, I move and wave in thanks.

From my experience, when riding a bicycle, it's tough to hear cars coming from behind. Even if I'm not riding with headphones on. Those little cycling helmets don't cover the ears. There's a lot of wind noise. And modern cars are pretty quiet. Getting surprised really sucks.

Perspective, patience, and compassion go a long way.

[stepping off of soap box]

amen brother.

 

[Hellgate]

In UK often cycle paths are segregated from normal paths, and are just that cycle paths.

Germany is the same way. I loved living in Frankfurt, no car needed at all. I got about on my bike, or if I needed to go further I took the subway, trolley or bus.

 

[YamaSpeed]

I ride a bike and obviously motorbikes.
I have all the gear...for both..you can`t knock people for wearing the right gear for the right sport.

I object far more to motorcyclists who think they are motorcycle racers than i do to cyclists.

Steve

Yup +1 there.


Yamaspeed

 

[fast blue one]

On a roadway cyclists are on the same side of the road and follow the same set of rules for yielding and right of way as motor vehicles. That helps to some extent.

Spend a day in London and you may wish to revise that thought. You have never seen such a self righteous rules don't apply to me and everyone else is in the wrong cos I'm green bunch of ****** as London cyclists.

 

[ozzieboy]

The irony of this thread is that we as motorcyclists bitch about dumbass cagers all the time. Yet when the shoe is on the other foot...

LOL....I'm a creature of habit I guess. The main things I biatch about with cagers matches that of the cyclists...and the odd group of motorcyclists.

Don't stop or dawdle round blind corners, Stay in your lane, head check when moving across the road or changing lanes and respect the safety of other road users.

I'm not treating anyone differently....lol...I hate them all equally.


+1 on the tone of this thread. Great to see different views expressed without abuse.

Cheers
Mike

 

[sfcali86]

yes i agree they need to be regulated

 

[bcbikernurse]

Well on Sunday morning shortly before 8 am, a small group of cyclists were run down in the bike lane up in Ottawa. All five were hit and one has not come out of unconciousness. He suffered massive brain injuries. They did this every weekend and participated in triathalons. Some idiot, I'm sorry to say drove right into them and all five were found unconcious strewn over 120 metres (394 ft.). The guy left the scene but did turn himself in two hours later. FYI....all were wearing all protective gear. I feel for this man as he is married with two children and I'm assuming small because he is only 36 years old. They did everything right and still a cager ran into them and hit them all. I don't think it matters who is on the road we all need to watch and anticipate things in advance. Yes we all get very frustrated over some very stupid things being done but we all have to stay very clear headed and focused.

 

[Erci]

That's terrible

I don't think it matters who is on the road we all need to watch and anticipate things in advance. Yes we all get very frustrated over some very stupid things being done but we all have to stay very clear headed and focused.

+1. Very well said.

 

[rabernar]

Meanwhile in Texas:

Governor Perry (R) vetoed measures that "would have required motorists to give cyclists at least 3 feet of clearance when passing on most highways".
Perry, a cyclist who recently broke his collarbone in a mountain-biking accident, also vetoed a “safe passing” bill that was a top priority for vulnerable road users.

The veto of the cycling measure, which would have required motorists to give cyclists and others at least 3 feet of clearance when passing on most highways, drew a strong reaction from some cyclists.

“We are stunned because he’s our guy, and we feel disappointed, even betrayed by our guy,” said Robin Stallings, executive director of BikeTexas, the educational arm of the Texas Bicycle Coalition. [[Hmmm, I smell slinky smooth yellow spandex-RAB]]

A San Antonio newspaper commented that bill opposers thought it could lead to bicyclists texting in offending license plate numbers to local police if the bill became law.

'Vulnerable road users' [[My quotes applied here, but apparently language is from the bill - RAB]] would have included pedestrians, highway construction and maintenance workers, tow truck operators, stranded motorists or passengers, horseback riders, bicyclists and motorcyclists.

Many of those road users already have operation regulations and restrictions in state law, Perry said.

“While I am in favor of measures that make our roads safer for everyone, this bill contradicts much of the current statute and places the liability and responsibility on the operator of a motor vehicle when encountering one of these vulnerable road users,” Perry said.

Nuther words: 'Youre gonna go ta jail if ya smack em anyway, bubba'.

 

[CCHOUSEKY]

Ok, so I missed this thread while at Deal's Gap, but I feel I can add to the conversation.

Let me start by saying I agree with everyone...Boneman's frustration is understandable, if not a bit over-the-top, and from all the motorcycle/cyclists that have responded, I get their point of view also.

Around here, the city has made it a big priority to be bicycle-friendly. We've put in tons of bike lanes, posted hundreds of "Share The Road" signs, etc. I think it's fantastic.

However, I do have reservations in general about cyclists crying wolf when it behooves them. While they are completely unprotected, there are measures they can take to make the ride much safer. For instance, don't ride on two-lane, hilly, 55-mph country roads. Maybe that sucks for the cyclists, but it's better to live another day than to be just over the crest of a hill when a car crests said hill and takes you out. Even if you're single-file, you're still out in the lane and you can't maintain a safe speed.

But the biggest thing that drives me crazy about cyclist (at least around here) is their blatant disregard for traffic laws. They're constantly screaming how they are just as much a vehicle as a car and should be treated as such. Fine. I don't have a problem with that. But when you're riding with traffic, in the lane with other traffic, and arrive at a red light only to move to the shoulder and ride through the crosswalk (and through the red light), I've got a problem with that. If I did that in my car or on my FZ6, I'd end up in jail.

Don't scream about "rights" when those of you abuse them by breaking the rules.

 

[mstewar1]

snip...
But the biggest thing that drives me crazy about cyclist (at least around here) is their blatant disregard for traffic laws. They're constantly screaming how they are just as much a vehicle as a car and should be treated as such. Fine. I don't have a problem with that. But when you're riding with traffic, in the lane with other traffic, and arrive at a red light only to move to the shoulder and ride through the crosswalk (and through the red light), I've got a problem with that. If I did that in my car or on my FZ6, I'd end up in jail.

Don't scream about "rights" when those of you abuse them by breaking the rules.

I hear you. From my experience, the kind of rider you're talking about either ends up riding alone or, if they can find people who will ride with them, they ride with other self-centered, irresponsible riders.

I've had car drivers get mad at me because we arrive at a stop at the same time, I stop, put my foot down, and wait for them to go. While their behavior or response suggests to me that they were expecting for me to just not stop and blow through the stop. A bit of a no-win situation.

Self-centered folks really do mess up things for the rest of us.

 

[JohnTex]

Sorry, I missed this post while riding with teammates near Aspen Colorado last week. 450 miles of incredible leg-busting climbs, screaming descents, and beautiful scenery, all on narrow roads AND WITHOUT ANYONE HONKING OR YELLING AT US! Of course we obeyed the rules of the road, even though we were decked out like tour de france riders.

The initial post is dead-on correct about SOME cyclists thinking they own the road and being jerks- but that is a minority of guys who forget what they are doing & where, and that they should also SHARE THE ROAD or they can die. I teach bicycle safety training to cyclists at work, and stress safety on all my group rides, but it is amazing how some people decide that they are on a mission of some sort, and lanes, stop signs, and redlights do not apply to them. I don't know if I have been cussed more by motorists over the years, or by other cyclists who I am trying to get to ride more sensibly. As you know, this happens with some motorcycle riders (seen wheelies on the freeway, lately, or lane splitting at 100+mph?), and even with cagers (riding anything near my plant at 5:30 pm contractor quitting time is a deathwish).

In some cases, on narrow roads that we can't easily avoid, my groups will ride a tight 2-abreast , forcing cars to slow or wait to go around. We have done these stretches single file in the past, but found cars are then more likely to try to squeeze by (they don't fit, anyway), and force you off the road. At these times, we make sure to stay in one group, so that once a car is past, they aren't held up by another group of 4-5 people. As I said we try to avoid these roads like the plague, but our city planners sometimes place these where you can't miss them (i.e. a nice bike path/lane road separated from all others by a mile of narrow road- it happens).

For the record, I have commuted to work on a bicycle (40-50 miles) for almost 20 years, in addition to racing (legally!) on the road & track. I average 7500 miles per year on the bicycle, vs. 8k on the FZ6 and 15k in the cage. I have developed and taught bicycle safety courses for over 10 years, hopefully helping others understand and use the rules of the road. But there are still risks which must be minimized: just like on the motor, I have plenty of friends who have been doing everything correctly and legally, but still got hit and/or maimed.

I really recognize the dilema cyclists face in finding safe places to ride- the wide shoulders on most of our local highways (now suburban thouroughfares) have been replaced by <1 ft of pavement because some bean counter (nothing against all bean counters...) decided to restripe and add a center turn lane, rather than widening a road. The really sad part is that I have a daughter who placed top 5 in the nation on a track bicycle, but is now giving it up because she doesn't feel safe training on the road, and we can't find any good places within 50 miles. Believe me, driving that far 3x per week to train will wear on you.

Ride safe and please watch out for all 2-wheel vehicles.

 

[Moeginny]

I wonder if I can entice our local 13 year old, military wanna be's to ambush them with airsoft pellets? Maybe a Dairy Queen for every Tango Down? Just kidding.

 

[abraxas]

We do marshalling for cycling events and practices, so i've spent quite a bit of time round these guys and gals.

They're certifiable, i'll swear that in a court of law. They have the traffic sense of road kill, and the survival skills of lemmings.

However .... i do support their right to be on the road, and to do their thing.

Frankly, we have much in common with them, and they're the bottom of the road food chain, not us. It is in our own best interests to at least share the road in a kind way.

We're all using the same roads

 

[Soap]

Why would you think that it would always be bad??? A horn wasn't desinged to be a thing of "evil" and to only be used at someone who did something bad!!

Then what would you have one do when coming up on a group of riders 4 abreast going 15km slower than traffic? Nothing? I'd rather let out a little honk 'before' I come up on them than just BINGO, here I am right behind you.

So let me get this right:

A- if I honk, i'ts taken as "always bad" and I'm an idiot for startling you.
B - if I don't honk and come up right behind you I'm an idiot for startling you without any warning.

Damned if I do, damned if I don't.

Sorry, but if someone tooting their horn is going to be taken as "always bad", and is going to startle you then I would strongly suggest not riding your bicycle on the road anymore.

Well if you come up behind some cyclists as it was made to sound and hammer on the horn how do you think they would take it because you would get more than just a few choices words from me, of that you can be sure.

There is a simple solution to it, just change ******* lanes. Now our rides are mainly single carriageways, but even there i move over the central white lines to go past them. But then again I can sound the horn and drive them into the grass and gravel verges.