Rough/Inconsistent Idle

[AlisAquilae]

Hello,

I was hoping to get some help diagnosing an issue with rough and inconsistent idle on my 2009 FZ6. I've done a little searching around on this forum and other forums but haven't been able to come to any definitive conclusions.

I am experiencing really rough idle and sputtering/loss of power under acceleration from a stop light. I also feel that my bike is just running rough in general.

1. Can Sta-bil fuel stabilizer (which was used in conjunction with a full tank of premium fuel for the winter from Thanksgiving to last Monday) cause such an issue? After taking it out of storage with a full tank of fuel/stabilizer, I rode it down to a half tank. I filled it back up with 93 octane and rode it down to a half tank again. Then filled it back up with 93 octane today. Could there still be enough fuel stabilizer in the system to cause this kind of issue?

2. I've seen a lot of talk about the TPS going bad but this seems to apply only to earlier FZ6s. Is this true or could I also have a faulty TPS?


Thanks,
-B

 

[FinalImpact]

Mr/Mss -B,
Stabil won't cause that. You have something else going on. Do you have an FSM? It has a play by play list of things to go through.

So what's the history on the bike? How many miles, does it have new plugs? Has the fuel tank ever been rusted up, is there any chance Rodents inhabited the bike, what is your skill level towards investigating????

If it has these in the proper proportions, it should be OK.
Air
Fuel
Spark
- mechanical stuff, that normally doesn't go bad from sitting.
- when is the last time it Ran Properly?

 

[fb40dash5]

I had about the same issue with my '04 the last 2 seasons. I tried new plugs and that would fix it for a bit, but not permanently. Ditto for 'fixing' the plug boots on the wires. I thought I'd figured it out for good last year when I found the fuel line kinked inside its foam sleeve, and that did seem to improve it, but not 100%.

I ended up putting a battery in it this year since my Deka ETX wouldn't live more than an hour off my tender, and it runs fine now. I can't say with certainty, but it makes sense, and it kinda explains the plugs band-aiding it for a bit... at idle you're drawing juice, not making it, and you need decent voltage to fire the plugs. If the fuel line had been leaning it out, that would make even more sense.

I probably should have load-tested my battery, especially last year when I had to keep it plugged in if it sat for a week or more... even worse considering I worked at a shop.

So there's that, and I'd also check the plugs/gaps, and reseat the boots while you're there.

 

[FinalImpact]

^^ adding too this.... // Good points BTW! :thumbup:

We've had cases of worn vacuum lines where they rubbed a hole in them. This allows unwanted air into the engine and messes up the idle.

Another candidate is a dirty Run/Stop switch. It powers the coils for ignition to the engine. If its routinely used, it can acquire dirt/debris to a point of not conducting energy effectively.

If it was running properly last year, I don't see the "Throttle Body Sync" as a cure. Although the act of doing the sync may lead to the actual problem. i.e. taking stuff apart to look.

Lastly; throw some fuel dryer in the tank. It may have moisture in it...

 

[fb40dash5]

Another candidate is a dirty Run/Stop switch. It powers the coils for ignition to the engine. If its routinely used, it can acquire dirty to a point of not conducting energy effectively.

Huh... never noticed that before. Why didn't they just tie that into the cutoff relay circuit?

I think I cleaned mine when I put a G2 tube on it last winter, even though the most use it sees is someone flipping it to screw with me... I just use the kickstand or key.

Also, why wouldn't the action of flipping it on and off clean the contacts rather than t'other way around? Not saying you're wrong, just curious, I never paid much attention to it.

 

[FinalImpact]

As grit and dust stick to the lube the act of flipping wears the contacts ever so slightly. Thus opening the clearance and basically reduces the "friction interference contact" making it easier for debris to be caught between the contacts and induce more wear.... Its just mechanical wear from not being sealed.

Which reminds me - I should inspect mine even tho I never use it.

Just a guess, but stuff like this, coupled with things like that lower battery state, and they could cause issues. Either one by itself could go unnoticed though!

 

[AlisAquilae]

FinalImpact,

I believe I printed the service manual a while back but do not have it with me. I cannot find the file that I had printed from - is there one available online somewhere?

I have owned it for two years: bought it at 5300 miles and currently reads 8300 miles. I have never changed the plugs and I doubt the previous owner did either. The fuel tank has no signs of rust, it has been stored full with stabilizer each winter for about four months. No rodents. I am fairly comfortable with automotive things (Mechanical Engineering student, previous intern at Chrysler (SRT) and GM etc) but this is my first motorcycle.

I tried the diagnosis mode today. I held down both "Reset" and "Select" buttons, turned the key and waited. When it went into diag mode the screen read "d1".


Any advice?

Thanks,
-Billy

 

[FinalImpact]

Hey Billy,
The manual is out there, I posted a link in the last 30 days tho I'm not sure where....

Plugs are WAY overdue if those are the originals. I'd start there as you have no idea of their condition. CR9E and gap to 0.027" Amazoo has them for cheap. Although most will opt for some kind of precious metal and require less changing.

Start there - Vibration! A cure for bad vibrations, Spark Plug Caps!! at least read the first post, and make room to work by removing the two left bolts on the radiator and pull it over a tad, allow it to settle for more space.

Any chance the tank has water in it? When is the last time it ran properly? PS - if the meter is not broadcasting an error. Nothing to learn there.

 

[AlisAquilae]

FinalImpact,

Thanks, I will look for it.

Until I find the manual, what is the typical maintenance schedule for spark plugs on the FZ6? It seems that it must be MUCH shorter than the lifespan of plugs in my truck.

Ashamedly, I haven't been giving too much thought towards maintenance for my motorcycle, being at school and all. The only service I've done so far since I've own the bike is an oil change and a couple applications of chain lube. Anything else I need to do in the near future?

I don't think the tank has any excess water in it. It's never been exposed or left open and I'm very careful when filling up. It ran very well when I put it in storage last November. It hasn't been the same since I pulled it back out a week ago.


Thanks for the tips,
-Billy

 

[FinalImpact]

In short the moisture is in the air so its not like it has to be opened for it to condensate and be pulled in. If it was running Good when parked and it was kept full of Stabil (brimmed), thats a good deterrent and is usually enough.

Vehicles sitting outside tend to go through more temperature changes and during a cool down from a higher temperature tend to condensate and this adds moisture to the fuel.

From another thread....

Not to lead the witness or break the rules. Just saying the info is out there... How to search 101... Blah

FWIW: previous post was in error about plug change miles. FSM calls for 8000 mi (13000km). The reason being is its a waste spark system and the plugs get fired TWICE as often per power stroke. Most do seem to be running OK at 10 - 14,000 miles. But I'd look just the same...

Follow the link and peak at the PERIODIC MAINTENANCE section.
Fluids come to mind:
Brakes w/Dot 4 yearly but most do every 2 years
Coolant flush and fill
Fork oil flush/dump and fill
Lubricate cables / clutch every 2500 miles
Air filter - inspect at bare minimum
Check all fasteners yearly at minimum...

Q? Does it clean out and pull OK from say 5000 RPM up?

TAG: JJD952 manual FSM

 

[AlisAquilae]

FinalImpact,

I see, I have now run through another tank and the situation has not improved. Due to my housing situation right now, I will not be able to do any serious maintenance for a few more weeks but will promptly check the plugs etc as soon as possible.

To answer your question, at RPMs higher than 5000 there are no issues with loss of power or sputtering idle.

A mechanic briefly mentioned that an air leak somewhere in the system was a common cause for this type of symptom. Is there any validity to this statement and if so, what can I look for?


Thanks,
Billy

 

[FinalImpact]

Thread Title: Rough/Inconsistent Idle, really rough idle and sputtering/loss of power under acceleration from a stop light. I also feel that my bike is just running rough in general.

You need to determine if its FUEL or Ignition OR mechanical. If it runs out OK at 4500 RPM upwards to 10K its likely not mechanical.

Idle takes a lot from the ignition as does accelerating on a lean condition as a lean burn is harder to ignite. The reason I say idle is hard is because the dwell time and saturation of the coils is higher. Thus, a leak in the wire causes a misfire. hint: run the engine in TOTAL Darkness look CLOSE at Spark plug wires for arcs jumping.

I'd suggest you get those plug out, look over the ignition wires and perhaps look closely at the coils for damage, cracks, contamination. Disconnect the battery and pull apart connectors to the ECU, Injectors, and coils. Inspect the Run switch. All can be done in a few hours.

That's where I'd start. Solve what it isn't and that leaves what it is...

I DO want a CLEAR answer - does it pull strong from say 8 to 12K? If it doesn't Fuel Pressure May be Suspect!

 

[AlisAquilae]

Thanks, I will plan to take those steps within the next few weeks here as time and weather permits. Lots of rain in my area lately and I have to work outside in the parking lot.

To answer your question: Yes, it pulls strong from 8-12K (and also anywhere else above 5K) just like it did when I first brought it home.

I'll report back with any issues once I've looked over the plugs/connectors/electricals.

Thanks,
Billy

 

[FinalImpact]

FinalImpact,

I see, I have now run through another tank and the situation has not improved. Due to my housing situation right now, I will not be able to do any serious maintenance for a few more weeks but will promptly check the plugs etc as soon as possible.

To answer your question, at RPMs higher than 5000 there are no issues with loss of power or sputtering idle.

A mechanic briefly mentioned that an air leak somewhere in the system was a common cause for this type of symptom. Is there any validity to this statement and if so, what can I look for?


Thanks,
Billy

Knowing it runs "normal" in the upper rpms really helps eliminate fuel and spark related issues.

It may very well be a vacuum leak. Per your question, Yes, an air or vacuum leak could cause this as there should be other shortcomings if present.
New direction:
Check battery connections
Run stop switch
Lift tank, remove airbox and inspect vaccum lines.

Do a seatch for "JJD952 vacuum leak" and you should find a color chart of suspect hoses/fittings. I think the thread title was " rode through a flood " or something like that.