FZ6 FZ8 FZ9 - where are we going with this?

[Smersh]

I was a little surprised to see the 2014 lineup (I'm in the US, so i'll speak to the US lineup). One thing is clear - FZ6R is definitely not a replacement for FZ6 - nowhere near that.

I see a few issues here:
Engine size:
So, in a short order, people who wanted a sub-kilo-bike from Yamaha ended up having to go from 650 cc to 800cc to 900cc. Granted, FZ9 is cheaper than FZ8, but if i'm spending 8k, i may consider just getting FZ1, and to save money I'll just get a used one, so there goes a new bike sale (why not FZ9, since it's a "deal" compared to FZ1 - see Style below). Sure, i miss out on the latest and the greatest technology, but also the platform is proven. I'm guessing the insurance will be similar anyways - it sure will be higher than fz6.
There are a lot of conversations about the engine size, and I'm a firm believer that most 600/650s have plenty of power to satisfy my every day needs. Unlike cars with ever-increasing gadgetry, power consumption, I don't think bikes need this power creep up. Is this change solely demand driven, i.e. Americans are so power-hungry?

Style: Also, both fz8 and fz9 are geared toward a customer in a market for a naked, short-wheelbase brawler. I have appreciation for that, but what about people who are looking for a good all-around faired bike that i can throw topcase/sidecases on. It used to be our FZ6, and it could be converted from a faired to naked if needed and now it's all. FZ9 is naked only - no S model that i'm aware of, so we are off to the land of custom fairings, which makes FZ1 that much more attractive.

Competitors:
I'm not familiar with sales trends in the motorcycle industry, so i'd love to hear from people who do, but out of three japanese manufacturers, I only see this issue of "let's go for bigger engine, more aggressive bike" with Yamaha:
Suzuki has their SV650 line for a sporty sub-kilo bike, GSXR for a sport bike in 600/750/1000 and touring can be done on their Vstrom 650
Kawasaki has Ninja lineup that pretty much covers the entire range from 250 to 1000 in 50cc increments ;-) (fine they are more comparable to FZ6R, but again, there are higher powered models there that are not necessarily 1000cc). And they have Versys and of course the venerable KLR650

Conclusion of my rant: I'm really hoping that FZ9 is a test bed for the engine (design), and Yamaha will return to the faired sub-liter bike category. Or, alternatively, they come up with a 650cc competitor to Versys and Vstrom (bring 660 Tenere across the pond?). I'm not in a market for a bike right now, but in a few years, I may look into replacing FZ6, and I'm not convinced I need a liter bike, and as much as i love my FZ6, depending on a number of factors, if this situation doesn't improve, I may just switch altogether (I would still consider FJR, but that's a whole different animal)

What are your thoughts?

 

[dschult2]

My thoughts are that Yamaha sees how immensely popular the Street Triple is and wants to try and break into that market. And I don't think it's cost effective for any company to have too many models so some things have to go. The FZ6 actually went a few years ago so now the FZ8 is going the way of the Dodo bird. And honestly Americans lust for bigger and badder has a lot to do with it. The FZ6 simply did not sell as well here as across the pond. In Europe Yamaha still offers the FZ8 and the Diversion which is the replacement for the FZ6. It's all about what sells and unfortunately somebody is bound to be disappointed.

 

[Erci]

FZ1 - Sure, i miss out on the latest and the greatest technology, but also the platform is proven. I'm guessing the insurance will be similar anyways - it sure will be higher than fz6.

My insurance did not go up at all when I went from FZ6 to FZ1. Currently, I have full coverage (highest limits on everything) and my yearly premium is $165.

I'm a firm believer that most 600/650s have plenty of power to satisfy my every day needs. Unlike cars with ever-increasing gadgetry, power consumption, I don't think bikes need this power creep up. Is this change solely demand driven, i.e. Americans are so power-hungry?

Well.. yeah!! Merica!! When individuals are asked to choose between a small apple and a big one.. how many opt for the small one? We just take it to the next level here!
Of course no one needs a liter bike. However, there ARE benefits.. FZ1 is far more relaxed on the street and not nearly as buzzy. There's no need to keep the RPMs up (when I commute, sometimes I'm below 3k RPM.. try that on a 600!). You also don't need to shift as often if you don't feel like it, due to much higher gearing (though you still can, should you want to).
Reduced fuel economy is the biggest drawback, but most argue that it's worth it.

Conclusion of my rant: I'm really hoping that FZ9 is a test bed for the engine (design), and Yamaha will return to the faired sub-liter bike category. Or, alternatively, they come up with a 650cc competitor to Versys and Vstrom (bring 660 Tenere across the pond?). I'm not in a market for a bike right now, but in a few years, I may look into replacing FZ6, and I'm not convinced I need a liter bike, and as much as i love my FZ6, depending on a number of factors, if this situation doesn't improve, I may just switch altogether (I would still consider FJR, but that's a whole different animal)

I think it's a fair assumption that the new motor will make its way into other bikes. Journalists love it. Fuel eco is as good as the I-4 600 and torque is up there with the I-4 liter. FZ9S would be pretty cool!
BUT.. if that doesn't happen by the time you're ready for a replacement, I bet there'll be plenty of used, but as new FZ6 S2 and FZ1's out there to pick from!

 

[FIZZER6]

I think it's a fair assumption that the new motor will make its way into other bikes. Journalists love it. Fuel eco is as good as the I-4 600 and torque is up there with the I-4 liter. FZ9S would be pretty cool!
BUT.. if that doesn't happen by the time you're ready for a replacement, I bet there'll be plenty of used, but as new FZ6 S2 and FZ1's out there to pick from!

The lack of a faired version is what would hold me back on the FZ09. A fairing similar sized to the FZ6S2 with the same platform underneath and a bit larger rear seat with larger rails is all it needs to replace the FZ6.

 

[iSteve]

The FZ 09 is really not in the same class as the FZ8 and FZ1 it is really part of the MT 01 and MT 03 line up that yamaha uses as a public concept vehicle. It is also a 850cc bike that I think is after not only the speed triple but the SV650 and ninja 650 market. I already hear that honda is looking at this market with a all new middle weight striped down V4.

 

[Water Bear]

Well the fz9 has short range and no real luggage capacity judging from the tiny tail. At the press launch Cycle World covered the first day was spent doing city riding, so they definitely seem to have that mind. The inline triple provides more torque than their previous inline 4 offerings, and presumably is as large as it is in displacement to maintain some of that power.

I don't know who buys it or why, but it seems to be an easy-to-drive bike for the city. It continues in the same direction as bikes like the fz6, which were detuned for the kind of torque that makes bikes easier to drive on, for example, daily commutes.

 

[Dave.TX]

Over time you will own many, many bikes. If you stick to one brand you'll be disappointed.

I agree with Erci about liter bikes in that you don't have to shift as often as there is power down low. You don't have to sit at 8,000 RPM to get a punch. My mileage (depends on the bike) is pretty darned close to what the FZ6 offered me on a daily basis and mine is an 1157cc inline 4 - according the Fuelly website the 15,000 miles that I've ridden it I've averaged 42mpg - the FZ6 netted me a 45mpg average.

There's lots of buzz about what Yamaha should be doing but aren't. At least the triple is there, wait to see what they do with it. Bikes come and go, unless you're Harley then they stick around for 40 years with only upgrades being they fixed the oil leaks and put fuel injection on.

Lots of folks look at the Ninja 1000 for all around capabilities from commuting to fun in the twisties to touring. The new one has ABS and available hard bags, not to mention the sweet liter engine. It's rare I see a Ninja 650 or even an FZ6. I see SV650's nearly every day.

Over time your riding style will change, your taste in bikes will change. If you love the FZ6 that's fine. It does a lot of things well. It's gone (at least new) for us in the States. Yamaha has moved on and eventually you will too. Kicking and screaming it seems.

 

[fastar1]

Three cylinders will be the new engine architecture for a whole range of bikes at Yamaha. You can rest assured they won't all be above 850 cc.
Patience, grasshopper.

 

[Ssky0078]

Fz-09: They do have a faired version in other countries. For some reason they don't offer the half faired version in the US. I have heard that the belief of the manufacturers is that the US market either wants a fully faired super sport style or a naked/standard look.

5f8b53cb-7453-4303-aad2-c6b93202cb9f_zpsb22612aa.jpg Photo by Agustin_Ross | Photobucket

The Fz8 is going away. It's been mentioned in a number articles by now. I think the Fz8 was Yamaha's way to continue to use the Fz1 engine, change the displacement and style to the streetfighter and test the US market as well as around the world for sales. It must have went well because they released the Fz-09.

The triple engine with crossplane crank is going to be introduced into a number of new bike designs. I have heard someone already ask for a Super Tenere with the 850 triple in it. It would go up against the F800GS and Tiger fairly competently. If you put the Fz-09 numbers on those bikes they would be awesome, 110 hp and 70 lb*ft torque. Sounds like a beast on and off the road. The triple engine is also cheaper for Yamaha to manufacture and lighter. From a business standpoint this is advantageous in cost conscious 'Murika right now.


Fz6R: is a snooze. I really thought the bike was boring as hell to ride, and almost as bad as a Ninja 300. It felt heavy and under powered.

Fz1: I'm scared will be going away. They haven't put any money into the bike for 8 years. I think it would be interesting if they would take the crossplane i-4 from the R1 and put it in a newly designed Fz1.

 

[Erci]

5f8b53cb-7453-4303-aad2-c6b93202cb9f_zpsb22612aa.jpg Photo by Agustin_Ross | Photobucket

That looks pretty damn good!!

 

[metallicat]

My insurance did not go up at all when I went from FZ6 to FZ1. Currently, I have full coverage (highest limits on everything) and my yearly premium is $165.

Careful, you keep showing off, and one of their agents will read your post and fix their mistake!! I pay 2x that for liab only on my wife's scooter

 

[FZ09Bandit]

IMO why they really are not faring the Fzs is because they still have to market and sell the R6. I'm pretty sure if they faired the sport tourers, since most people don't do their homework, they would choose a faired fz over an r6 just because it's bigger displacement, and most of the time, cheaper price.

I tried to get a new r1 and they bank said nope- to much. The fz1 is right around 5k cheaper. If they even resembled a race replica bike, we would have asshats everywhere running around on our bikes.

 

[Ssky0078]

That looks pretty damn good!!

The only trick is notice that it says "CG" next to the pic. It might not actually be released. Also note that it has the Gen II Fz1 exhaust.

 

[Water Bear]

Maybe all we're seeing is a trend towards people wanting bikes that have all the look of a sport bike but are actually driveable.

It wouldn't be at all un-American to just want to look the part, while quietly having and eating our cake.

 

[PhotoAl]

Water Bear - totally true. I want the look of a sport bike with a little more wind protection, the suspension and go also. For me a faird FZ9 would be great but til then I'll keep on enjoying my CBR with the raised (slightly) clip-ons. I can get a pretty good sized bag strapped on the rear seat.

AND

I want a Honda Grom