Aftermarket brake line selection

[zixaq]

Probably about time for me to clean my brakes and change the fluid, and I'm thinking about changing to SS lines while I'm at it. I was wondering:

a) Is there any meaningful difference in quality between different suppliers of SS lines?
b) Do they all do two lines from the MC, or is there a supplier that has lines that match the stock configuration (single MC line, then the loop over the fender).
c) Is it worth the ~$150?

I've been getting some front wheel slide under heavy braking lately. I know there are other problems (mostly the nut that fastens the handlebars to the seat), but I was thinking that any little thing that might help me control the brakes better couldn't hurt.

 

[Ohendo]

Not sure I understand your "front wheel slide under heavy braking" issue... do you mean the front wheel is locking up?

I know the company I purchased from will let you specify the line style; i.e., an independent line to each caliper or a single line with the fender loop.
Core moto USA Performance Brake lines | Coremoto.com

Like other brands, you can specify colors, custom lengths, etc. ~$150 as you mentioned. But the cost isn't that much more than replacing the rubber lines and hardware with OEM parts.
Can't speak for other brands as to the meaningful difference...just have my own experience. I purchased the FZ6 package with two independent lines from the master and +2" to accomodate my bar risers. Excellent quality, for sure. And they definitely made a difference from my original rubber hoses. Brakes grab much quicker than before (and lock quicker too - took a minute or two to adjust my braking style).
Would they make a difference vs. new rubber hoses? Not sure. But I have to think the SS will outlast rubber at least.

Extra points for CoreMoto products: they're made in the USA. Hope this helps.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I have the Hel, two separate lines up front.

You can get them either that way or like the stocker (one over the fender).

The brakes are MUCH firmer, no rubber expansion under hard braking.

HEL will custom make your lines different lengths if needed. I stayed with silver lines and got slightly longer fronts as I have risers/ setbacks.

I suspect any name brand lines would be fine. The Hels were also made in the US.

I did have to custom make some brackets for the lower fork legs to secure the lines. The lower half is exactly like the stockers, the top modified so I could zip tie the line to the top (made of aluminum)

 

[agf]

I too, went Hel. Made in Brisbane to my spec length for risers that i never fitted. I also went stock over the fender, a little trickier to bleed but looks like stock. Yellow lines on yellow bike just looks better than the rubber
The feel is just firmer



my iPhone post using Tapatalk - sorry for any shpillong mishtooks i has fat fingies

 

[zixaq]

Yeah, I meant the front was locking.

I changed the brake fluid by accident today. Meant to clean the calipers and pulled a piston out completely, so I had to flush and refill. Locking up seems to not be a problem now, but the brakes are kinda spongy, so I must have air in the system somewhere that I can't get out. Unfortunately I don't have time to rebleed them until next Sunday. Also, my reservoir leaks now, so that's a thing . . .

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I'd strongly suggest, while it needs bleeding, to put new seals in the calipers.

Yamaha recommends replacement every TWO YEARS.


I did my fronts (07 model) a couple years ago when they were dragging.

Last month, the rear was starting to drag. W/O use, the disc was VERY WARM / HOT to the touch. A new $10.00 seal,
nice and cool when not used, working great...

 

[ozgurakman]

for the rear brake, braided line is overkill except custom looking.

For the front, brake feel is very fine.
There is significantly differences between brands for quality. I bought HEL brand, it's like brand new but Venhill branded lines which is on my friends' bike has not got stainless banjos and mounting hardware.

Buy tested and certified lines for your safety, my $.02

 

[zixaq]

Following up on this thread now that it's done. I ended up getting a set of CORE Moto lines:

Granted, this is with a change over from the stock calipers to the R6 blue spots. I'm not sure I can sense a dramatic difference in brake feel. If there's an improvement, it was minor. Apparently my 12-year-old stock lines were still in good shape.

The Translucent Blue lines look pretty good on the FZ6, especially with the blue accents on the R6 forks/brakes. I'll try to get a picture of the finished product up today. No problems with fitment or leaking, except the lines are maybe an inch too long, so I had to be extra careful figuring out the routing. On the plus side, if I ever throw risers/setbacks/other bars on, I shouldn't have an issue.

I'd strongly suggest, while it needs bleeding, to put new seals in the calipers.

Yamaha recommends replacement every TWO YEARS.


I did my fronts (07 model) a couple years ago when they were dragging.

Last month, the rear was starting to drag. W/O use, the disc was VERY WARM / HOT to the touch. A new $10.00 seal,
nice and cool when not used, working great...

I would NOT recommend anyone do the seals unless their brakes are dragging. It's a pain in the ass, you get covered in brake fluid, and a set of seals for blue spot calipers is going to set you back $70+.

 

[Andz]

I fitted HEL dual lines in front and one on the rear about a year ago. Much better braking. Caliper seals are still the 2004 originals.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I wouldn't change them out either if not needed.

With an air compressor, it's really not that hard to do...

It takes me longer to bleed them than rest of the job. Maybe 1.5 hours total R&R..

(2), 4 piston, S2 calipers will set you back over $100 for both sides in US..

 

[elus1ve]

Just contributing to this thread - also did the braided line but on the cheap. Got the Venhill on Ebay and asked for a custom length so that I could replicate the exact setup of the factory brake lines. I personally think there isn't much of a difference in performance compared to two separate lines. Brake pressure should be equal on whichever setup according to Pascal's principle and hydraulics. The original setup does not require additional brackets or mods and looks better imo.

I didn't notice much in terms of performance initially but quickly noticed that I was very comfortable braking with one finger, which I wasn't before because I had to progressively press harder and harder. On the back I did not notice anything at all.

The kit for front and back was CAD 170 + shipping. Let me know if you need the measurements for the OEM setup. The one that they provide as OEM is much longer than OEM.

Also did the brake calipers at the same time. A bit annoying to do but not hard.

Note: The line in the picture has a bit of a weird angle to it. Has fixed it since.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

At the time I installed my separate HEL lines, I don't believe they had the over the fender one line set up (like OEM).

I'd prefer the OEM layout if I had to do it again, I agree, it looks much neater. A little harder to bleed than two lines but
how often do you empty the entire hydraulic system?

 

[heath_AU]

Front wheel slide? Eeek. Thats a bit ****e.
I have goodridge stainless clears and they are brilliant. Standard passthrough line over front guard (which annoys me slightly)
You may want to take out your pistons. I couldnt figure out why i was going through brake pads so quickly but then i noticed uneven wear and found a few of my pistons were VERY dirty and getting stuck or jammed.
Cant tell you how much better they are now.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Got the Venhill on Ebay and asked for a custom length so that I could replicate the exact setup of the factory brake lines. I personally think there isn't much of a difference in performance compared to two separate lines. The original setup does not require additional brackets or mods and looks better imo.
]

You got me to e-mail HEL and see about getting an "over the fender", caliper to caliper line and make it back into the stock configuration. I never liked the "look" of the dual lines and couldn't get it to route nicely.

Just a side note, you have to remember, for the rear brake line, you may not feel any difference as its MUCH , MUCH SHORTER than the fronts and much less expansion feel due to the shortness..

Question, did you have any problems bleeding the over the fender line (ie air stuck at the top of the loop) and if so, did you remove it from the fork and place it level (or so) with the left side (just for bleeding?)

 

[elus1ve]

You got me to e-mail HEL and see about getting an "over the fender", caliper to caliper line and make it back into the stock configuration. I never liked the "look" of the dual lines and couldn't get it to route nicely.

Just a side note, you have to remember, for the rear brake line, you may not feel any difference as its MUCH , MUCH SHORTER than the fronts and much less expansion feel due to the shortness..

Question, did you have any problems bleeding the over the fender line (ie air stuck at the top of the loop) and if so, did you remove it from the fork and place it level (or so) with the left side (just for bleeding?)

Oh, didn't mean to cause you trouble

Putting brake oil the first time was a pain and it was full of air bubbles - lots tiny air bubbles coming out - think carbonated drinks. Could be due to the new lines and changing the caliper seals at the same time. Gave it a day rest and bled it again, this time with the left brake off the fork and hanging midway between the brake oil reservoir and the right brake. Went much smoother and the air came off easily. Only did one subsequent bleeding at the end of the season and did not have to unbolt the brake off the fork this time.

I would suggest asking them for a specific length of brake lines. I had checked a few brands at the time and their length was always longer than OEM, which would make the line miss the passthrough on the top of the fender. For some reasons, they all set the length to 1 to 2 inches longer. The length is a bit less important for the line that goes from the left brake to the reservoir as there is no passthrough that can be missed but I had that shorten as well so to avoid having too much cable 'hanging' + I had lowered the handlebar as well which also shortened the distance between the reservoir and the brakes. Venhill (the brnad I got) had no issue doing custom length, the guy said they cut the line when an order is place, not ahead of time. So custom length does not make any difference for them whatsoever. I had to order a couple of different angled banjos too to make sure I got it right and there were no weird angles. I can send you detailed pics (and better lit pictures too) if you think that can help.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Oh, didn't mean to cause you trouble

Putting brake oil the first time was a pain and it was full of air bubbles - lots tiny air bubbles coming out - think carbonated drinks. Could be due to the new lines and changing the caliper seals at the same time. Gave it a day rest and bled it again, this time with the left brake off the fork and hanging midway between the brake oil reservoir and the right brake. Went much smoother and the air came off easily. Only did one subsequent bleeding at the end of the season and did not have to unbolt the brake off the fork this time.

I would suggest asking them for a specific length of brake lines. I had checked a few brands at the time and their length was always longer than OEM, which would make the line miss the passthrough on the top of the fender. For some reasons, they all set the length to 1 to 2 inches longer. The length is a bit less important for the line that goes from the left brake to the reservoir as there is no passthrough that can be missed but I had that shorten as well so to avoid having too much cable 'hanging' + I had lowered the handlebar as well which also shortened the distance between the reservoir and the brakes. Venhill (the brnad I got) had no issue doing custom length, the guy said they cut the line when an order is place, not ahead of time. So custom length does not make any difference for them whatsoever. I had to order a couple of different angled banjos too to make sure I got it right and there were no weird angles. I can send you detailed pics (and better lit pictures too) if you think that can help.

View attachment 67050

That's funny you mentioned the longer lines. I just literally got off the phone with Hel (great folks!) and talking with their technician.


I told him I needed the over the fender line ONLY, that I didn't like the looks of the dual lines. He mentioned that front, over the fender line was 22".
I happened to re-measure the stock line and its 19", NOT 22".

Needless to say, he asked for pic's, which I sent, and some of the ends at the master were different(one incorrect??) Pictured all of that for him.

Anyway, their going to call me back shortly after he see's my pic's and measurements and make me a 19" line. I can use one of the other two long lines up to the master...

And no, your post wasn't a bother. It looked crappy and should be right, so it will be soon... (Thank you!)
BTW, HEL apparently did have the over the fender lines back then, the option wasn't told or given to me at the time, bout 6 years ago..

I also asked re bleeding as sometime there's an issue with over the fender loops. As normal, start at the far caliper. Should you still have mucho air, either pull off the whole system and get it level or so to bleed or at least bring the far caliper over to work out the air...

 

[FinalImpact]

Two comments:
The fix for bleeding is $1.00 syringe and some pliable tubing. Open only one bleeder, open it no more than a 1/2 turn, fill the reservoir (leave lid off), compress syringe completely and attach it to open bleeder.
Pull back on syringe slow and steady.
Watch MC reservoir and don't let it suck air.
If one stroke is not enough, close the bleeder and repeat. Then do the otherside topping MC as needed.

Works flawlessy and in seconds you have results!
Pressure bleed once lines and calipers are full.
Mind you the bleeder will suck air past the threads. The further you unscrew it, the worse it gets!

Second item:
FZ1 bars and the MC rotated for proper fitment and hand reach. On my faired bike the banjo at the MC nearly hits the fairing. Having two lines would make this worse. I'm all for the single line.


Last bit; do your brake work on the lowest humidity day possible as brake fluid absorbs moister. The dryer the day the better and your fluid will last longer! Which means less corrosion of aluminum components or rusting of untreated steel components.

 

[zixaq]

Two comments:
The fix for bleeding is $1.00 syringe and some pliable tubing. Open only one bleeder, open it no more than a 1/2 turn, fill the reservoir (leave lid off), compress syringe completely and attach it to open bleeder.
Pull back on syringe slow and steady.
Watch MC reservoir and don't let it suck air.
If one stroke is not enough, close the bleeder and repeat. Then do the otherside topping MC as needed.

Works flawlessy and in seconds you have results!
Pressure bleed once lines and calipers are full.
Mind you the bleeder will suck air past the threads. The further you unscrew it, the worse it gets!

Second item:
FZ1 bars and the MC rotated for proper fitment and hand reach. On my faired bike the banjo at the MC nearly hits the fairing. Having two lines would make this worse. I'm all for the single line.


Last bit; do your brake work on the lowest humidity day possible as brake fluid absorbs moister. The dryer the day the better and your fluid will last longer! Which means less corrosion of aluminum components or rusting of untreated steel components.

Syringe trick works even better if you use it to backfill from the caliper up instead of pulling from the MC. Only necessary to do this (or vacuum bleeder) for empty calipers, of course. If the system is full I find it easier to just manually bleed with the lever.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I have a commercial grade Mity Vac brake bleeder(aluminum).

Just making a plan "B" if needed..

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Got my new, 19", "over the fender" line ordered!

Next weeks project!