Cage quicker than FZ6 (???)

[Valles240]

Regardless, if I pulled up next to some turd with a 800 hp 4-banger, I'd be too busy laughing at him to be able to race. Can't we just let the fast and furious die like the crappy movie it was.

I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about when you say an 800hp 4-banger. It's not 'some ricer' that makes a 4-banger have 800hp, that is a lot of money and time into that motor, and honestly you probably would have no clue when one pulled up to you. Seeing as how you are ignorant i will let your comment go as a mistake, but next time, before you post, don't talk out of your ass.

 

[MrTurner]

Right..

Power to weight ratio of FZ6 = 326bhp/tonne (dry weight of 186kg, plus 90kg for rider/fluids).

Power to weight of a few exotics:
529 - Veyron
445 - Carrera GT
384 - Murcielago LP640

So really only extremely powerful and exotic cars. I'd be too busy drooling. If I feel no spittle, I know I have a chance.

 

[SHinNH]

Not many.

words it needs more words to let me post.

3.4 secs to 60, things faster than that. It its faster than that at least it will be fun no matter what. Even if it is, and they make a mistake the bike will win.

I dont know many cars that will do 60 in first gear like our bike. if its just 0-60.. you dont really even have to shift.

Scott

 

[HavBlue]

I dont know many cars that will do 60 in first gear like our bike. if its just 0-60.. you dont really even have to shift.

Scott

How's about 70mph with a jump to 80 when it hit second gear, would that float your boat? Funny thing is that car was less than 6,000 new. Yenko.......

Just remember, paper racing is one thing and actually doing it is another because there aren't many riders that could hit a 0 to 60 in 3.4 on an FZ6. In contrast there may be a number of folks that could hold a car in a straight line to 60 in that time if the car could do it.

 

[SHinNH]

How's about 70mph with a jump to 80 when it hit second gear, would that float your boat? Funny thing is that car was less than 6,000 new. Yenko.......

Just remember, paper racing is one thing and actually doing it is another because there aren't many riders that could hit a 0 to 60 in 3.4 on an FZ6. In contrast there may be a number of folks that could hold a car in a straight line to 60 in that time if the car could do it.

thats friggin quick....I dont think I have ever owned a car that could even compete.

 

[HavBlue]

2. What is so funny about 2L 4 banger making 800hp? Our 4G63 (2L inline 4cyl) powered talon delivered 749hp to the wheels, that was years ago, without any nitrous and it lasted many races. That is remarkable to say the least. Most modern GA aircraft use opposed 4 cyl relatively small engines. (very similar to that of Subaru Impreza) There is a good reason why. But if you want to talk aircraft engines, that's whole other topic.

OK, lets straighten this out a bit. The 4G63 is a variant of the Mitsubishi 4G61 which was 1595cc and built in a dual overhead cam 16 valve configuration. This would later be modified into the 4G62 for the Cordia and Tredia between 1983 and 1989. Later, a modified 4G63 was used in the Evo and from the factory this engine had just shy of 300hp. It never, ever, had 749rwhp from the factory. I will however say they have been known to handle 500hp on the stock bottom end parts while running 25 pounds of boost. At 749hp you can bank on the fact that engine is anything but the original 4G63.

 

[FzPilot]

OK, lets straighten this out a bit. The 4G63 is a variant of the Mitsubishi 4G61 which was 1595cc and built in a dual overhead cam 16 valve configuration. This would later be modified into the 4G62 for the Cordia and Tredia between 1983 and 1989. Later, a modified 4G63 was used in the Evo and from the factory this engine had just shy of 300hp. It never, ever, had 749rwhp from the factory. I will however say they have been known to handle 500hp on the stock bottom end parts while running 25 pounds of boost. At 749hp you can bank on the fact that engine is anything but the original 4G63.

...are you nuts? have I even left the "hint" that this was the original stock engine? But if you want to get specific, the crank and the rods were stock! the only modification to the crank were lightened counter weights (knife edge mod)
I know i put it together myself

and here she is:





the turbo used next to the large gatorate bottle:




Back then it was very hard to find AWD dynos, so we've used FWD talon for that purpose, it would smoke the tires all the way through third gear easily:





My buddy Martin continued to mess around with these engines and opened now, well known performance shop AMS. They currently have worlds most powerful 4g63 car. 1130Whp. This is wheel horse power, most cars on the market advertise the BHP or power measured at the crank, simply because it is a much higher number and more attractive to the buyer. This (heavily modified ) 2L 4 cylinder makes well more than 1200 crank hp.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqEFIMBumJs"]YouTube - AMS EVO VIII Makes 1130 AWHP!!! WORLD RECORD![/ame]

and here it is at the track back when it was making around 900whp:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zwKYgjzq4U&feature=related"]YouTube - AMS Evo Traps 171mph[/ame]

 

[Valles240]

Your friend is the guy from ams? Damn man, that's pretty crazy. They build insane evos.

 

[isk]

I like how you guys hijacked the thread talking about track cars that you'd never run into on the street. And yes, I'd laugh because if you did run into one of those guys who are driving around on the street with the sole intent to look "cool" and prove something, then they do deserve to be laughed at.

 

[MrTurner]

Still think it's a damn sight easier to get a fast launch on a bike than it is in a car. Too much weight, too much power to transfer in the car. I've never wheelspinned giving too much on the bike, whereas the car is far too easy to spin up, and mine only has 240bhp through the front wheels.

 

[marke14]

You know I beat a guy in a brand new M3 with a neglected 2004 Kawi Vulcan 500. I guess it all depends on your launch.

 

[HavBlue]

...are you nuts? have I even left the "hint" that this was the original stock engine?

Actually you never hinted it was or wasn't. For all you're done I would rather have a Busa or ZX-14 for a lot less time and money...... That's what makes the FZ6 so interesting as it truly is a sleeper.

 

[Mattberkshire]

Oh bejesus you guys seem to be fixated on 4wd 2L japcrap. Now, I love subaru impreza's etc but unfortunately most in the UK are driven by dunderheads who look they've covered it in superglue and ram-raided Halfords.

Skylines, evos etc etc etc. Blue lights underneath. Poor dental health, white baseball caps. No girlfriend. These people are unskilled in both the professional (i.e. job) and driving sense. Us peoples who ride our FZ6's and other bikes are a higher breed. We belong to the biker community who are generally ostricised by the wider community yet whom have much higher road skills than the purely car driving road users.

We frequently read and absorb articles regarding better riding skills. Most of our number partake in training to further our skills. Every mile we ride is an education.

Whereas these gold wheeled ninnies in their bass'ed out jap crap try and look cool with oooooh 850 horses at the wheel. Any one of us could whup their asses in a shoot out using both bikes and cars.

No car can beat me from the line unless it is a mega exotic Veyron etc and how many of those do you see on the road???? Porsche 911. No chance loser. I'll beat you

Itchyfanny EvoIIIVVVXXXIII. F*ck off loser. You are and always will be a sad man loving retard

 

[HavBlue]

This is wheel horse power, most cars on the market advertise the BHP or power measured at the crank, simply because it is a much higher number and more attractive to the buyer.

The reason the manufacturers use Brake Horsepower is because it is advertised and it must be accurate. If not, then you have the Yamaha scenario where the folks on the street dyno'ed some R6 bikes and found the redline wasn't what was advertised so they (Yamaha) offered to buy them back. The BHP runs are also certified by the SAE.

 

[Valles240]

Oh bejesus you guys seem to be fixated on 4wd 2L japcrap. Now, I love subaru impreza's etc but unfortunately most in the UK are driven by dunderheads who look they've covered it in superglue and ram-raided Halfords.

Skylines, evos etc etc etc. Blue lights underneath. Poor dental health, white baseball caps. No girlfriend. These people are unskilled in both the professional (i.e. job) and driving sense.

This is really sad that it ends up this way in some communities...just goes to show what a certain crowd of people can do with any type of car.

No car can beat me from the line unless it is a mega exotic Veyron etc and how many of those do you see on the road???? Porsche 911. No chance loser. I'll beat you

Itchyfanny EvoIIIVVVXXXIII. F*ck off loser. You are and always will be a sad man loving retard

Umm, yeah. I dunno what kind of people you've run into in the uk, but they must not be able to drive at all, because there are tons of cars that would beat the fz6. Not that it isn't fast, because it is, but throw a tbe and tune on an evo/sti and you will not be able to hang. guaranteed. Just watch it with a coc.ky attitude on the road, because some people will make you eat your words. But take it to a track, then you can really see without anyone dying.

The reason the manufacturers use Brake Horsepower is because it is advertised and it must be accurate. If not, then you have the Yamaha scenario where the folks on the street dyno'ed some R6 bikes and found the redline wasn't what was advertised so they (Yamaha) offered to buy them back. The BHP runs are also certified by the SAE.

Wrong. bhp is not more accurate. Brake horsepower (bhp) is the measure of an engine's horsepower without the loss in power caused by the gearbox, generator, differential, water pump, and other auxiliary components such as alternator, power steering, and AC compressor. Thus the prefix "brake" refers to where the power is measured: at the engine's output shaft, as on an engine dynamometer. The actual horsepower delivered to the driving wheels is less. -wiki made it easy on me explaining this to you. whp is more accurate because it accounts for the drivetrain losses. You ride around on a bike, with tires and a transmission, not just an engine. And the manufacturers like bhp more because it inflates their numbers, another reason why they like the sae-certified numbers (the way they do it inflates the bhp slightly). Horsepower measured at the wheels is more accurate than measured at the flywheel.

 

[HavBlue]

Wrong. bhp is not more accurate. Brake horsepower (bhp) is the measure of an engine's horsepower without the loss in power caused by the gearbox, generator, differential, water pump, and other auxiliary components such as alternator, power steering, and AC compressor. Thus the prefix "brake" refers to where the power is measured: at the engine's output shaft, as on an engine dynamometer. The actual horsepower delivered to the driving wheels is less. -wiki made it easy on me explaining this to you. whp is more accurate because it accounts for the drivetrain losses. You ride around on a bike, with tires and a transmission, not just an engine. And the manufacturers like bhp more because it inflates their numbers, another reason why they like the sae-certified numbers (the way they do it inflates the bhp slightly). Horsepower measured at the wheels is more accurate than measured at the flywheel.

Man do you smell what you are shoveling here because I do. Have you ever seen a manufacturers certification test? Obviously not because you wouldn't be writing what you're writing. True, a chassis dyno can offer road horsepower but this isn't what the manufacturer is after, nor is it what they are advertising. The DJ unit for bikes doesn't offer true rear wheel horsepower either and this is why units like the Factory Pro are used. Problem is people get disappointed when they have a look at their sheet from Factory Pro after having been on a DJ. I know, they must be wrong, right???

 

[FzPilot]

The reason the manufacturers use Brake Horsepower is because it is advertised and it must be accurate. If not, then you have the Yamaha scenario where the folks on the street dyno'ed some R6 bikes and found the redline wasn't what was advertised so they (Yamaha) offered to buy them back. The BHP runs are also certified by the SAE.

Ok, so tell me, how is measuring power at the wheels less accurate???

For example you bought a car with 150 Crank HP. Now lets try to figure out how much of that hp went to the pump, to the alternator, friction of the belts weight of the pulleys, oh the transmission, lets not forget the drive axles! ahh.. damn should have just measured at the wheels! like all bike and car racing professionals do.

So no, reason for BHP numbers advertised is because they are higher and more appealing.

This is exactly the same reason Cessna for many years sold their airplanes with indicated arispeed in mph instead of kts (knots) like everyone else. Because it looked better when advertised cruise speed was 150 vs 130. Look it up, it's a known fact.


HavBlue, to tell me that i should get Busa or ZX-14 for a lot less time and money to be as fast is like telling me I should eat a burrito instead of a hamburger, that's just not what I like - get my point?

BuggerLugs... "Itchyfanny EvoIIIVVVXXXIII. F*ck off loser. You are and always will be a sad man loving retard"
wow man... and i always I thought it was the crowd of "higher inelegance" riding fz6's


Anywhoo, I am leaving this thread alone, it seems people are starting to take this personally and i really don't want to offend anyone, if i did, my apologies!

 

[sjk625]

This thread is pretty entertaining lol. I just wanted to say the FZ6 is definitely faster than an Evo/Sti with a turboback. I've driven plenty of Sti's when I previously worked at a Subaru dealership, and the only ones that would be able to hang with an FZ6 were ones with big turbo swaps. Basic mods and a tune will not make them faster than an FZ6.

I've also driven many WRX's like the one you own, Valles240,
and when you said you were only four car lengths away from a 1000cc bike and actually pulled a 600cc bike I was hysterical. You do realize most 1000cc bikes are capable of running high nines to low tens in the quarter, and the 600's are not too far behind. I'm not trying to take away from your car, because I really enjoy WRX's, just understand that a 600 or 1000cc bike is way faster.

I also see that your searching for an FZ6 at the moment, I wish you luck in finding a good deal. Be safe when you end up making your purchase, and keep it on two wheels. Once you get accustomed with the bike, and have the opportunity to twist the throttle back you better hang on, because it's a little faster than your giving it credit.

 

[Valles240]

Man do you smell what you are shoveling here because I do. Have you ever seen a manufacturers certification test? Obviously not because you wouldn't be writing what you're writing. True, a chassis dyno can offer road horsepower but this isn't what the manufacturer is after, nor is it what they are advertising. The DJ unit for bikes doesn't offer true rear wheel horsepower either and this is why units like the Factory Pro are used. Problem is people get disappointed when they have a look at their sheet from Factory Pro after having been on a DJ. I know, they must be wrong, right???

What are you talking about? I didn't compare dynos once. I was simply stating that whp is more accurate than bhp, and that manufacturers would rather show the bhp numbers because they are higher numbers. What the manufacturer is after is selling bikes. Big numbers = selling bikes/cars in their eyes. I don't get why you are trying to prove that one dyno is better than another, because obviously some dynos are better than others, and as i cannot speak for bike dynos because i have not gotten a bike dynoed i did not mention any specific machines. I think we are pretty much saying the same thing? whp > bhp.

sjk - thanks man i really hope i can find one. About the r1, i said i got through third and he was four lengths ahead of me. I don't think he was racing at all, i honestly think he did a pull through first then let off...and as for the r6, i really don't know, maybe he sucked ass at shifting, because he was at my rear fender from a 3rd gear roll into when i shifted into 5th and let off at 120+ then he flew by. If he wasn't racing, then he was doing a damn good job of pretending like he was, with 3honks and everything...So i guess i am basing the fz6 speed off of an r6, and that might be wrong, so my bad if i am completely mistaken. I guess we'll have to find out, and i'll bring a video camera with me ...too bad i dont race on the street, oh well, anyone wanna go to the track?

 

[dako81]

Most cars you will come across on the street can't take you to 100, but some can and if they run you into the ground just give some respect, they've earned it. But don't race on the street. At the track it is a fair, no cheating race.

I think that for many vehicles it can be beneficial to run both engine dyno and chassis dyno tests because not only do you want to maximize your engine HP, you want to minimize your driveline loss. An engine with 450hp might outrun a 500hp engine if there is 18% driveline loss on the 450hp and 30% driveline loss on the 500hp.

I appreciate all kinds of vehicles that people take the effort to modify themselves and change it from stock.

You have to remember there will be dumbasses that are into everything, and just because you see a dumbass doing something doesn't mean that everyone else doing that is a dumbass too.