Pillion Problems

[Kriswithak]

I know this probably isn't the 100% correct place for this but didn't want to open a huge discussion in one of the other forums (particularly if my partner sees it)

I took my fiancee for a ride on the back today, and it was terrible.
She was putting all her weight forward into me instead of into the pegs, was counter leaning through corners, or leaning back on acceleration and sliding forward while braking. At one point the front wheel came slightly off the ground because she leant back so far when I took off, and I was taking it EASY. She holds on around my waist which doesn't bother me at all, but was loosening her hold at key times when she should have been tightening it.
Needless to say it was a really bad ride, especially with heavy traffic and not that enjoyable for me, although she didn't mind too much, and generally enjoys being the pillion. She also isn't normally this bad either.

Has anyone got any tips that might be helpful?

Oh and I was trying to get her to lean up against me and hold on with her legs so that she wouldn't counter lean on corners etc, but all I ended up doing was having to push back with my neck because she leant her helmet against the back of mine heavily.....

 

[Have2BeFree]

Since we women tend to be a little uhhhh.......emotional I would tread carefully. But since it is a safety issue I think you need to discuss it with her. I would start with "you know honey, the last time we rode you didn't seem to be yourself? Is everything OK? Usually you ride really well but this time I noticed..................and was really concerned about your/our safety." Then just listen. Good luck.

 

[JayJay]

Im sure once wolfman recovers from his hang over he may be able to give you some actual pillion tips as he seems to have plenty of experience riding with pillions.

I followed him out to Mallala and he still seems to ride like a demon with a pillion.

 

[shuckle]

At our MSF course the best tip i got was to ask the rider to look over the driver's shoulder that they are turning. That gets them to lean the correct amount.

As for sliding back and forth... no idea. maybe put some glue on the seat.

 

[Fred]

I give my pillion the "sack of potatotes" lecture.

Sit back, enjoy the ride. You may see me moving around on occasion and shifting my weight. This is not a cue for you do the same. As the passenger, you should be like a sack of potatoes. Don't move around. If the bike leans over, don't try to stay upright, and don't try to lean with the bike. Just stay planted in your seat like a sack of potatoes.

If you need to move around at all to get comfortable, please wait until the bike is not leaned over in a corner. Your weight shifting around while the bike is leaned over can be very upsetting to the bike and to my mental state.

 

[Dennis in NH]

Since we women tend to be a little uhhhh.......emotional I would tread carefully. But since it is a safety issue I think you need to discuss it with her. I would start with "you know honey, the last time we rode you didn't seem to be yourself? Is everything OK? Usually you ride really well but this time I noticed..................and was really concerned about your/our safety." Then just listen. Good luck.

Hm... always nice to hear a woman's point of view before proceeding.
I wonder if it's best not to tell her to be a sack of potatoes or else she'll come back with "am a just a sack of potatoes to you?"

I'd read up on this carrying a passenger topic using some google search because there's a bunch of it. I think main thing is that sack of potatoes advice above. Another thing is that she has to trust your skills, lean with you etc. I won't give much more advice on this since I've never had a passenger on this bike.

On my cruiser, I had my daughter (about 70lbs) and a friend's daughter (about 140 lbs). My daughter felt a little heavy at first because she didn't really know fully what to do and after some training, she felt lighter. My friend's daughter felt really light from the beginning because she was an experienced passenger (her boyfriend used to take her on his sport bike). My point is the rider needs to learn how to ride too.

Dennis

 

[Kriswithak]

Since we women tend to be a little uhhhh.......emotional I would tread carefully. But since it is a safety issue I think you need to discuss it with her. I would start with "you know honey, the last time we rode you didn't seem to be yourself? Is everything OK? Usually you ride really well but this time I noticed..................and was really concerned about your/our safety." Then just listen. Good luck.

Thats the first thing I did, and she said she was fine, enjoyed the ride despite the heavy traffic and noticing it was less comfortable for me due to me asking her a few times to change something she was doing.
She was actually in a great mood since I was taking her shopping and she got some shoes she wanted. I just felt it wasn't that great and a few things she did really annoyed me because they could have been a serious saftey issue if anything had gone wrong!

Thanks for the tip on looking over the shoulder, I'll definately mention that to her and see how we go. I also have a bag securing 'thing' on the pillion seat which I clip a bag onto, that doesn't have good grip like the rest of the seat, I might try removing that and see if it helps.

I try and avoid riding if I'm in a bad mood, so I definately wouldn't let anyone on the back if either of us wasn't in the best of moods

I'm pretty light ~70kg so I'm not sure if that is screwing up the balance of the bike with someone slightly lighter on the back.

 

[necrotimus]

Just remember it is the riders responsibility to instruct his passenger. Just like the rider is responsible for his passengers safety.

Too many people just let someone hop on the back of their bike with no coaching. The last thing I want is a passenger who doesn't know how to passenge.

 

[Wolfman]

Im sure once wolfman recovers from his hang over he may be able to give you some actual pillion tips as he seems to have plenty of experience riding with pillions.

I followed him out to Mallala and he still seems to ride like a demon with a pillion.

Hang over! That's not the word for it! Out of Body Experience more likey!

As Jay Jay has said, i ride with a pillion a lot...a very experienced pillion at that, we have covered in excess of 15000km's on a bike together (conservative estimate).

We have toured, done lots of sport riding & even a little commuting, over the years...

First of all, my experience is that as a rider, you have a fair bit to do with your pillion feeling comfortable & confident on the bike for a start..

Being pillion is all about confidence i reckon..

Keep things smooth, make throttle response & braking as progressive as possible...even under heavy power (overtaking, taking off, etc), keep acceleration constant, rather than mind blowing!

When riding slow, try and maintain the same smoothness, minimise jerky throttle response, and where possible, use more rear brake, a lot of pillions dont like being thrown forward into your back...and i sure as hell dont like having my boys slammed into the tank!

It aint easy on the back of a bike, you have no control of the bike, and all your trust is put in the rider in front of you...

I always like to ask at every stop, even traffic lights if all is ok...just in case something is bothering the pillion, which may affect our ride...

I also find that if you are getting negative body language from your pillion, like excessive squeezing of legs, or an upright seating position through corners, even a hint, then something is up....

A confident pillion looks through corners, mimics your body position, and is not hanging on for dear life!

So in the end, i reckon it's all about the rider....i ride completely differently two up...lots more rear brake, keeping the bike more level under braking, smooth throttle....feathering the clutch, here and there helps heaps...avoid hard stops, and heavy & sudden acceleration....

unless of course your pillion is a nutter, and doesnt mind the front wheel waving around in the air, and can hold their body position tight in sport riding conditions...

I reckon anyone can be a good pillion, my 10 year old son is also very good, Ozzieboy will attest to this...he looks like a natural...he does have no fear though! And once again i ride completely differently with him on the bike....very very bloody carefully!

Riding two up can be horrible if both of you are not riding as a team...

My tips for talking about it is simple...just chat about it how it feels on the back, and if they are not happy, or worse, are literally soiling themselves! as it sounds like could be the case here, ask them what is bothering them, then try and fix it by making adjustments to the way you ride, and by asking the pillion to try and fix what is bothering you...you will sort it out...it's just km's in the saddle together...

I love riding two up, especially when touring...

That's my very lengthy 2 cents! :rockon:

 

[aussiejules]

Get a intercom , i have a $15 one and when she does the wrong thing scream at her, if she is like my girl she wont talk to for a day but hey at least you can tell her what you want her to do, to be safe.

 

[JayJay]

Hang over! That's not the word for it! Out of Body Experience more likey!

As Jay Jay has said, i ride with a pillion a lot...a very experienced pillion at that, we have covered in excess of 15000km's on a bike together (conservative estimate).

We have toured, done lots of sport riding & even a little commuting, over the years...

First of all, my experience is that as a rider, you have a fair bit to do with your pillion feeling comfortable & confident on the bike for a start..

Being pillion is all about confidence i reckon..

Keep things smooth, make throttle response & braking as progressive as possible...even under heavy power (overtaking, taking off, etc), keep acceleration constant, rather than mind blowing!

When riding slow, try and maintain the same smoothness, minimise jerky throttle response, and where possible, use more rear brake, a lot of pillions dont like being thrown forward into your back...and i sure as hell dont like having my boys slammed into the tank!

It aint easy on the back of a bike, you have no control of the bike, and all your trust is put in the rider in front of you...

I always like to ask at every stop, even traffic lights if all is ok...just in case something is bothering the pillion, which may affect our ride...

I also find that if you are getting negative body language from your pillion, like excessive squeezing of legs, or an upright seating position through corners, even a hint, then something is up....

A confident pillion looks through corners, mimics your body position, and is not hanging on for dear life!

So in the end, i reckon it's all about the rider....i ride completely differently two up...lots more rear brake, keeping the bike more level under braking, smooth throttle....feathering the clutch, here and there helps heaps...avoid hard stops, and heavy & sudden acceleration....

unless of course your pillion is a nutter, and doesnt mind the front wheel waving around in the air, and can hold their body position tight in sport riding conditions...

I reckon anyone can be a good pillion, my 10 year old son is also very good, Ozzieboy will attest to this...he looks like a natural...he does have no fear though! And once again i ride completely differently with him on the bike....very very bloody carefully!

Riding two up can be horrible if both of you are not riding as a team...

My tips for talking about it is simple...just chat about it how it feels on the back, and if they are not happy, or worse, are literally soiling themselves! as it sounds like could be the case here, ask them what is bothering them, then try and fix it by making adjustments to the way you ride, and by asking the pillion to try and fix what is bothering you...you will sort it out...it's just km's in the saddle together...

I love riding two up, especially when touring...

That's my very lengthy 2 cents! :rockon:

Not one piece of relationship advice. Nicely done. :thumbup:

 

[ozzieboy]

My advice to pillions?....Don't do it. It's horrible....get yourself a bike.....with good brakes and decent suspension and screeds of power instead.

If your girl thing decides she just has to bog your bike down, like my ex, then you want her to hang on with the thighs, so she can push into your back with one hand (stops helmet shmacking) and hold onto you or the grab rail with the other (stops her falling off the back).

If she's inexperienced, I found great success with getting one chick to hug my back. That way she moved exactly as I did. After a while she relaxed completely and could do it the other way. And it was rather nice...lol.

If you put another adult male on the back of your bike guys, remember, he won't grip you with his thighs (even if he's actually falling off the bike)and will be as far back on the bike as he can get, 'cause he doesn't want to squash his boys into your back. EDIT........If he does the opposite, watch your back...lol.

I've not done as many kays with a pillion as Wolfman, but I've clocked up a fair few, and never had any complaints.:thumbup:

Cheers
Mike

 

[Wolfman]

Not one piece of relationship advice. Nicely done. :thumbup:

Trust me...i am NOT the one to give relationship advice!

 

[Kriswithak]

Get a intercom , i have a $15 one and when she does the wrong thing scream at her, if she is like my girl she wont talk to for a day but hey at least you can tell her what you want her to do, to be safe.

Hahahaha that would be exact situation if I got one
At a few points I felt like reaching back grabbing her by the collar and pulling her against me to get the point across that leaning back is bad. She has a pair of boots on but they had large heels, and I don't think she quite understands exactly how to use the pegs despite all our riding.
She also rides a scooter which I think is teaching her bad habits (she was a better pillion before she started riding it)

Taking off steadily wasn't an issue, and braking was mainly ok too (although I feel like I burnt out my rear brakes in the heavy traffic by the time we got home), that being said I am a bit more aggressive in my riding than she is, so I'm not sure if she felt that, but again I ride alot more defensive with her on the back!

Each time we did stop I'd give her feedback and she would comment on anything she felt, which helped, but it didn't fix the problem.
She also commented on the clunky gear shifts but moving mainly between 1st and second I still havne't figured out how to avoid this.

I could feel her holding on reasonably tight, but I tend to prefer she holds on around my waist tightly because it forces her to move with me not against me, and makes me feel like she won't go off the back (never come close but I do worry)

Thanks for all the feedback btw everyone! Will try and go for a ride tomorrow in lighter traffic and on nicer roads and see how we fare!
I'll know I'm in trouble if I have another guys balls jammed against my back too

 

[ozzieboy]

Thanks for all the feedback btw everyone! Will try and go for a ride tomorrow in lighter traffic and on nicer roads and see how we fare!
I'll know I'm in trouble if I have another guys balls jammed against my back too

If that last bit happens and someone does this...:needpicslease, pretty please with a cherry on top ignore it...lol:scared:

Cheers
Mike

 

[Kriswithak]

If that last bit happens and someone does this...:needpicslease, pretty please with a cherry on top ignore it...lol:scared:

Cheers
Mike

Haha if someone says that I'll be taking out a restraining order!

Talking of shocking moments, I had to ride the fiancee's scooter into the city one day for an outing, that was a blow to my pride. She was on the back, very very easy to ride, and for a 250 plenty of power, but OMG MY PRIDE!

 

[Wolfman]

Haha if someone says that I'll be taking out a restraining order!

Talking of shocking moments, I had to ride the fiancee's scooter into the city one day for an outing, that was a blow to my pride. She was on the back, very very easy to ride, and for a 250 plenty of power, but OMG MY PRIDE!

Lol! I took a brand spanking new Kwaka GPZ250 for a spin yesterday....OMFG! What a beast! NOT! Lovely little bike...but got about as much grunt as a postie bike...or it felt like it anyway....

 

[alanrim]

Interesting topic as soon I have to start taking a good friend as pillion, She is a very experienced pillion, and every time I see her on the back of my mates she sits relaxed with hands on knees.

Thing is my mates bikes are old school, relaxed 1litre ish engines and seats and peg positions to match. Unfortunately my mates wifes are coming on more rideouts with us, which means I have been put in the frame as next in line to take the pillion (my wife rides too so spare pillion seat not a problem for me).

Thing is out of all the bikes I have ridden (15 years since I last took a pillion) the FZ seems the least suitable, especially with the change from 1st to 2nd, dead worried she is going to flip off the back.

Any tips that will help, she knows I haven't taken a pillion in a long time, and I have told her that the FZ will be nowhere near as smooth as the other bikes.

So apart from having the top box on all the time, anything that can help me too in this thread would be a bonus.

 

[Kriswithak]

Honestly I can't see you having issues with her going over the back like that At least not unless you really smoke it, I had the front wheel slightly off the ground the other day when I took off just because my pillion leant back right as I took off, but it wasn't a huge issue even so. With a pillion who is more experienced wouldn't have this issue.

The FZ6 is meant to be a great bike for pillions too, of all the naked 600's every reviewer gave it a big thumbs up in this department, plus of all the bikes I tried before I bought it was the nicest and most comfortable with a pillion on the back. (I am pretty light though at 70kg). It also has ALOT more power than alot of the other 600 nakeds, which are also acknowledged as being good (but not great like the FZ6') for a pillion.

I know what you mean by the first to second transition though. I've found the only surefire way of avoiding that is by changing into second really early (like reaaaallly early) just need to be careful your not lugging it, but second pulls really well from down low. I just dislike taking that much slower because speed gives a bit more momentum and balance for me when I have a pillion on the back

I wouldn't like any pillion not holding on to anything though, our roads are terrible and I've heard of a few really nasty accidents where the pillion did end up on the road, or even worse... :S

I had to laugh when I realised that the sportscity 250 scooter actually ran better than my FZX250. Alot better too. Not quite as hair raising of course

 

[Wolfman]

I know what you mean by the first to second transition though. I've found the only surefire way of avoiding that is by changing into second really early (like reaaaallly early) just need to be careful your not lugging it, but second pulls really well from down low.

1st to 2nd gets better after about 15000km's, but putting some decent oil in the bike like Motul 5100, or even better Motul 7100 in the engine helps, as does getting rid of those hideous rubber mounted rearests Yamaha inflicts upon us....they have way too much flex, and make the gear box seem sloppy...IMHO..

Other than that, feather the clutch....this helps to smooth out the clunkiness, by masking it with rev's.

:thumbup:

:thumbup: