Guard Rails: Petition Local Governments?

[lonesoldier84]

From Cloned's thread, but worth its own topic I felt.

Guard rails work great for cars. However, motorcyclists call them "guillotines" and with good reason. I personally am terrified of them. Whenever I see them I usually forego any passing to prevent being pushed off the road into them. If I am solo I usually slow down a fair bit if there is even a hint of gravel etc around the area.

They are so incredibly dangerous the way they are designed. It boggles my mind how little regard city planners give to bikers when it comes to these things.

How realistic is it to petition local governments to make a new style of guard rail for future guard rails and maybe even retro fit some old ones?

If I had a billion dollars I would pay out of pocket to do this in a few cities...but alas I am poor.

 

[ozzieboy]

From Cloned's thread, but worth its own topic I felt.

Guard rails work great for cars. However, motorcyclists call them "guillotines" and with good reason. I personally am terrified of them. Whenever I see them I usually forego any passing to prevent being pushed off the road into them. If I am solo I usually slow down a fair bit if there is even a hint of gravel etc around the area.

They are so incredibly dangerous the way they are designed. It boggles my mind how little regard city planners give to bikers when it comes to these things.

How realistic is it to petition local governments to make a new style of guard rail for future guard rails and maybe even retro fit some old ones?

If I had a billion dollars I would pay out of pocket to do this in a few cities...but alas I am poor.

Over here they've decided that it's such a small problem that they'll go ahead and use even the cable barriers....Cheese cutters

http://www.acprod.com.au/

http://www.parliament.wa.gov.au/pq/...ad9ab1afb6e53cc448257230007bad6f?OpenDocument


Don't know that a petition would help much but if you don't try you can not succeed.:thumbup:

Best of luck. If you go for it I hope it helps
:cheer:
Cheers
Mike

 

[wrightme43]

I am with you Lone, then things are bad news.

 

[Cloggy]

In Holland the government introduced their first motorcycle friendly guard rail in 2007, and are steadily modifying their older guard rails. This is really great as there are many tight (and fun) corners joining highways but these are especially dangerous because of the high speeds and guard rails.
Motorcycle action groups like the MAG, KNMV & (later) ANWB petitioned for this, and it paid off.

The Dutch government announced in Febuary that they will be introducing a mandatory safe road policy for the Netherlands which also takes the safety of motorcyclists into account. Here's the link (sorry in Dutch)

Those "cheese cutters" look nasty

 

[lonesoldier84]

wow:

The wire rope barriers are regarded as providing a safer and more forgiving environment for the majority of road users.

(3) The cost of installing wire barrier systems is approximately $100 per metre, which is cheaper than other barrier systems.

god damn....

I will give this some thought. Just making a petition may or may not help. I'm going to talk to our local city councillor.

 

[Andz]

As I just mentioned in another thread we are seeing the cheese cutter cable barriers appearing more and more here, I get the shivers every time I pass one.

 

[SovietRobot]

My life was saved by a guard rail, but it was a specific circumstance and I can imagine that it could've been a lot worse.

 

[thirty_too]

....It boggles my mind how little regard city planners give to bikers when it comes to these things...

no offense or anything.. but its engineers that do the guard rails, more specifically civil. Just saying, im in that field of study and we dont do guardrails lol.... but a petition to make safer guard rails and cables would be great!!!!! ill sign

 

[blchandl2]

Good luck. I have been trying to raise awareness of the hazards when "chip and seal" is used to re-pave roads. This is when they dump hot tar on the road, then dump loose gravel on top of the tar. Very dangerous when they just do small sections of road and don't post any warnings. Particularly, motorcyclists.

I have contacted ABATE to see if they could put there legal muscle behind it, their response was "it will only shed a negative image on motorcycles and only help those who want to ban them completely". Truth is, ABATE wants to use their legal assets to fight helmet and noise ordinances for the cruiser crowd.

My guess is the same excuse would be used for guard rails,etc. "they work fine for all other motor vehicles, so the problem is the motorcycles".


[Off Topic]
Two of my most recent magazines (Cycle World, I forget the other at the moment) had editorials about how the movement to restrict motorcycle noise levels is gaining ground. Personally, I find some of the exhausts too loud. I also find that many owners of large 4X4 trucks have even louder aftermarket exhausts. They are not being targeted with these new ordinances.

Face it, by riding a motorcycle, we have a target on our backs. Those who do not enjoy motorcycling are out to take away our sport using any method they can find.

 

[dako81]

Good luck. I have been trying to raise awareness of the hazards when "chip and seal" is used to re-pave roads. This is when they dump hot tar on the road, then dump loose gravel on top of the tar. Very dangerous when they just do small sections of road and don't post any warnings. Particularly, motorcyclists.

I have contacted ABATE to see if they could put there legal muscle behind it, their response was "it will only shed a negative image on motorcycles and only help those who want to ban them completely". Truth is, ABATE wants to use their legal assets to fight helmet and noise ordinances for the cruiser crowd.

My guess is the same excuse would be used for guard rails,etc. "they work fine for all other motor vehicles, so the problem is the motorcycles".


[Off Topic]
Two of my most recent magazines (Cycle World, I forget the other at the moment) had editorials about how the movement to restrict motorcycle noise levels is gaining ground. Personally, I find some of the exhausts too loud. I also find that many owners of large 4X4 trucks have even louder aftermarket exhausts. They are not being targeted with these new ordinances.

Face it, by riding a motorcycle, we have a target on our backs. Those who do not enjoy motorcycling are out to take away our sport using any method they can find.

That sucks, I guess non-bikers are just jealous?

I'll be pissed if they start doing more about exhaust noise. My mom works nights at a jail as a nurse. Recently the city decided it was going to put a big blinking sign with a generator on it in front of my parent's house, and run it all day long, for construction that was several blocks away. Far enough the sign could be down the road infront of a vacant lot. It was so loud and constant that she couldn't sleep. They called the city and they said it was too bad and the sign will be gone after a few days.

I've never heard he complain or say anything about cars/trucks/bikes with loud exhaust going down the road in front of their house. Not even when I got my bike out and was revving the crap out of it in the driveway. And she would have told me.

Anyways back on topic, I'm for safer gaurdrails. If they're spending taxpayer dollars, they shouldn't discriminate against cyclists. It can't cost that much more than what they're already getting raped for gaurdrails that are safer.

 

[Raid The Revenge]

You know what's funny about this topic?

I once saw a video on Discovery channel that talked about GUARDRAILS!!

The early versions were very dangerous because they were too rigid, causing people who crashed into them to suffer from G-FORCE shock.

Time went by and people started building guardrails with an absorption design, allowing people to increase the moments they spend in a high-force collision. The more time you spend in an impact, the less concentration of force you'll suffer.

However, a fatal flaw was the guardrail endpoint; it would stab anybody if they ran into it like a spear.

The newer tips of the guardrails were designed to absorb impact, like an accordion. You could have a truck-driver fall asleep at the wheel and crash into the tip of a guardrail, without being impaled.

Here's a guardrail in Canada that's designed to prevent vehicles from going off a cliff. It's more rigid, because it's intended to STOP a vehicle quickly.

 

[D-Rock]

The WSDOT just put up hundreds of miles os cable "cheese cutter" gaurd rails. They put them up thru the entire state of Washington. Scary looking things they are!

 

[dako81]

The WSDOT just put up hundreds of miles os cable "cheese cutter" gaurd rails. They put them up thru the entire state of Washington. Scary looking things they are!

They just did this on a section of median of I94 here, and they put them up right before winter. I think they do it so they have job security because there was probably, literally, 15-20 spots that I noticed, driving 3 days a week on it, where cars/trucks/bulldozers/blimps/whatever, had slid into the cables, ruining a 100ft section or more.

Then they have to come out and put in new metal posts and concrete them in, and then put new cable on, etc. This was over a period of only like 3 months that it got messed up this many times. They probably were out there working on it at least every other week fixing it when I went by, so probably more.

 

[ozzieboy]

One thing about the Cable Barriers. If they are used on a straight section of dual carriageway separated by a decent median strip then the chances of a bike or rider keeping momentum long enough to get near them is pretty unlikely.

Used for this application (to keep heavier vehicles from having head ons) I can't see too much trouble:thumbup:. By that same token.....if these other vehicles were bikes then the momentum is not there and the barrier isn't needed, Therefore.......

Everyone should be on bikes:cheer:

Cheers
Mike

 

[dako81]

One thing about the Cable Barriers. If they are used on a straight section of dual carriageway separated by a decent median strip then the chances of a bike or rider keeping momentum long enough to get near them is pretty unlikely.

Used for this application (to keep heavier vehicles from having head ons) I can't see too much trouble:thumbup:. By that same token.....if these other vehicles were bikes then the momentum is not there and the barrier isn't needed, Therefore.......

Everyone should be on bikes:cheer:

Cheers
Mike

There is a median between the two sides, but this wire stuff is on the inside edge of the Eastbound lanes. It butts right up to the pavement's shoulder, the inside part that's a few feet wide with the rumble strips.

There's enough median there to by itself prevent head-ons, and this location is flat, straight, and doesn't have icing problems (but what part of MI highway in the winter doesn't have "icing problems") caused by shade trees like many other sections just further down that I commute on.

There is really absolutely no reason for it there, it's the same as any other section that doesn't have it and doesn't have any problems. If there was a limited median there, something similar might be justifyable.

When cars go off the middle, which happens a lot in the winter in MI when out of state drivers come through, they almost ALWAYS spin and stop before even halfway through the median. Most of the time they don't make it through the 1-foot curl of snow from the plows on the inside. With this stuff, you slide off a little bit and you've trashed your car and the barrier instead of just going into a little bit of snow which people can always get pulled right out of easily, or drive right out of more often than not.

 

[antijoy]

The WSDOT just put up hundreds of miles os cable "cheese cutter" gaurd rails. They put them up thru the entire state of Washington. Scary looking things they are!

Yikes, I haven't seen any of those around SW WA yet.

I guess it's something to look forward to. There's always something else our government can do to discriminate against motorcycles. :shakehead:

 

[Scotty1122]

Something that goes to the ground is a basic design to start with!

Some info here: http://www.fema.ridersrights.org/crashbarrier/index.html

 

[lonesoldier84]

Something that goes to the ground is a basic design to start with!

Some info here: Motorcyclists & Crash Barriers Project

makes me cry tears of joy to see those. too bad we dont have em. im gonna try to see that city councillor on monday if i can.