Narcoleptic Electrical System

Late last spring my engine started cutting out on me. It would just die for half a second and roll start again. It idles fine and runs great except for that. I Checked the fuel and vent lines, battery connections, cleaned kickstand kill switch and even replaced the kill switch on the bars. About two weeks ago on my way to work, it shut down completely, lights, dashboard and all and left me on the median of I-5. About 5 minutes later I tried the key again and it started and ran normally. Got a couple more miles and same thing again. Took it into the shop and after two weeks of waiting they call and tell me they rode it, can't find a problem and it runs great.

I'm thinking it must be an electronic component that's getting hot, shutting down and then working normally when it cools off again.

Anyone have any suggestions aside from find a better shop? I don't want to keep riding it if it's going to leave me stranded somewhere or get me crushed on the freeway.

Alright, I've been thinking about this for few and concluded I have little to offer.

Things that come to mind are these:
Does the clock loose time? If the answer is no, that confirms the ground to the POD is good and the backup fuse stayed connected to the battery. I think that is something but not much.

So, lets ask ourselves this; what has the means to turn off the engine, the dash pod, not leave an error code, and then spontaneously fix itself?

Of course you will notice I made an assumption about the "error codes" but I'd like to think you would have mentioned that if it had them. :spank:

OK - my thinking goes like this, I need more info on what "does work" when it turned itself off. Does anything at all work? Flashers, brake light, power to anything?

IMO its not a fuel issue or a coil issue, its the things you suspect already. Because nothing works I'd say lets go for the jugular like the ignition switch itself!!! Although its not something that usually takes siesta as you mention above, it or its wires and connections seem very likely as its not mis-behaving otherwise.

Having said that I'd lift the tank, pull the air box, Need a LONG hex 3mm extension (like 10" or longer and preferably one with ball socket end). Now remove and inspect all connections found looking for something loose, pins pushed out, corrosion, erosion, fungus between connectors, anything out of place. As I said in a post elsewhere, park it before it gets you killed.

Here are some pictures from my bike when I did the dual head light mod, its really pretty painless to dig in and look! Well once past the air box at the TB's!

Remove the Battery and the airbox:


Look at all of these under the tank:


Remove the battery tray:


Mine has the fairing removed (10min job), see this loom below my hand, Follow it through the frame and disconnect it for inspection.


Under the left pod:


Under the right pod:


Ya, take it apart it and look the whole thing over. What you seek is likely between the key and the battery and the grounds. So start there. Most of this can be pulled apart and looked at in great detail in 2 hours. If you have to mend a wire properly it may take longer. . .But that's where I would start.

A short story about a POS JEEP! NOT MINE! :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

The vehicle had EFI and EI, and would just die but everything still worked. I'd open the fuel rail see that it had pressure, hook up spare injectors and plugs and anything else I could get my hands on to verify what quit but everything would work even when it wouldn't run! (Insert @ss whooping here)

Anyway, being dealt some bum cards repeatedly by evil jeep I decide to WIN the battle and find the fault. I designed and built an electronic test box that would essentially point the finger at the fault! That is; it would trigger and latch a light on if the item being tested lost ground, lost 12v, or went below a set voltage that I picked. It was power supply, a comparator circuit, a clock and latch with a reset button. Basically I'd pick something I thought should be powered or grounded all the time and connect a wire to it and my box and run it. It had 4 inputs. If an input lost power (12v for example, went below 11.5) it would lock the LED light on. Follow the wire to the circuit ad walla! With this box I found a wire to the computer that could loose power for fraction of second and brain wash the ECM. This box made it possible to find the fault because it would Latch and keep me focused on where the problem was. It was very handy and likely worth making a new one to sell to Jeep and German car owners! :spank:

Think outside the box sometimes and problems get solved!

Check your kill switch on the rightside handlebar the red switch. There have been a few members that said the contacts have corroded. When hitting bumps and making turns could cause movement in switch contacts.

Something else to consider/do.

You cold have a dead short in the battery. You hit a bump, an internal connection lets loose, battery is dead. With EVERYTHING loosing power. The connection makes contact again, you have battery power again.

BTW, How old is the battery? As Randy asked earlier, is the clock re-setting to 1200? (that would indicate a complete loss of battery power).

I'd start at the battery, get it load tested first (take it out, tap, shake, bump((as if hitting a bump in the road)) it some with a test light on it and check for continuity, etc). I believe there's also some connections /relay, etc right next to the battery as well.

If that pans out, I know you replaced the handle bar kill switch, as noted above, it is a common problem. IMHO, I would hot wire it for now and by pass the actual switch. I suspect the problem is likely the battery.

Does the bike sit outside/get wet often/salty air conditions, etc(I'm looking for likelyhood of corrosion issues).

****BTW, when/should you check the connectors (electrical terminals, any electrical connector including battery terminals, etc) as Randy mentioned, RE-ASSEMBLE with DILECTRIC grease. Its a great preventative measure for any or further corrosion issues. Available at most auto parts stores, its cheap insurance.

And PLEASE post your results/fix...

^^ All good but the Kill switch doesn't explain the dash pod going out but you know, the battery taking a big dump is possibility. I personally I have never seen them come back after opening, but I suppose one could. IMO, its likely something else on the main power buss.

I've had two in my life open. One on my Camry, just went to start it and it made a 1/2 rev and everything went dead. Across the terminals it measured 12.6V but Had ZERO load capicity. Although I think it half lit the dome light. The other was on my 650 Kawasaki jet Ski. I missed a log jump and bashed the hull on the log. Power went off after that. Nothing, no battery ouput.

The Camry, I turned off all options, had it jumped and drive it home 30 miles on the alternator.

FinalImpact said:

^^ All good but the Kill switch doesn't explain the dash pod going out but you know, the battery taking a big dump is possibility. I personally I have never seen them come back after opening, but I suppose one could. IMO, its likely something else on the main power buss.

I've had two in my life open. One on my Camry, just went to start it and it made a 1/2 rev and everything went dead. Across the terminals it measured 12.6V but Had ZERO load capicity. Although I think it half lit the dome light. The other was on my 650 Kawasaki jet Ski. I missed a log jump and bashed the hull on the log. Power went off after that. Nothing, no battery ouput.

The Camry, I turned off all options, had it jumped and drive it home 30 miles on the alternator.

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That'd be a dead short!!

+1 on the kill switch, I was thinking with it dying in traffic, the dash may have worked but he was busy with getting out of harms way..

Yes I'm thinking 3 things besides the battery connections. After they've been checked.

The assembly with the starter relay, on top of the the battery has the main fuse assembly. Carefully check the main fuse and assembly.

Check the ground/negative battery wire to where it's attached to the frame. You might want to add a star washer if it does not have one.

The battery may have an internal wide open. If the battery were dead shorting internally to the point there was zero voltage it would cause a fire or blow the case open. You at least smell it.

A hairline fracture where one of the terminals disconnects from the circuit inside the battery. As the battery expands the fracture opens and as it cools the fracture closes. Mechanical vibration would also effect this and at times it may weld it self for a few minutes as it arcs.

The fact that every thing is dumping, points to the main source of power transfer. Battery, Battery connections, main fuse and assembly and ground.

TownsendsFJR1300 said:

That'd be a dead short!!

+1 on the kill switch, I was thinking with it dying in traffic, the dash may have worked but he was busy with getting out of harms way..

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Not following the "dead short"????
As Cliff said, should it short they make heat fast - usually in the blow up mode. But the connections between the plates do open and that's where they can show good voltage but carry no load capacity.

I'd really like to know the root cause on this one. Hopefully it shows itself.

Really easy to have a shorted cell but that would translate to lower voltage battery with less amp hours. In this case he's going completely dead and that's an open circuit.

hope this doesn't hijack the thread, but i experienced something very similar yesterday where the power cut out (no lights, speedo cluster, etc). luckily, i was not riding at the time. just turned the key and the bike had a blip of power (tach needle rotated and stayed at fully rotated right). after a few minutes of turning the key off and on, i put it back on the side stand and turned the key on and power was restored. i assumed it was something loose in the side stand switch and didn't have the opportunity to check anything at the time. i will check next time and definitely subscribed to this thread for any suggestions! if i understand correctly, the kill switch and the side stand switch do not cut power to the lights or speedo cluster, correct? if so, i guess i'm looking for a possible short at the ground or bad battery? thanks!

edgeofnj said:

hope this doesn't hijack the thread, but i experienced something very similar yesterday where the power cut out (no lights, speedo cluster, etc). luckily, i was not riding at the time. just turned the key and the bike had a blip of power (tach needle rotated and stayed at fully rotated right). after a few minutes of turning the key off and on, i put it back on the side stand and turned the key on and power was restored. i assumed it was something loose in the side stand switch and didn't have the opportunity to check anything at the time. i will check next time and definitely subscribed to this thread for any suggestions! if i understand correctly, the kill switch and the side stand switch do not cut power to the lights or speedo cluster, correct? if so, i guess i'm looking for a possible short at the ground or bad battery? thanks!

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Another obvious possibility might be the ignition switch it self or the wire feeding and coming from the ignition switch. If all the other possibilities check out start checking the wires in the steering area (Where they bend) and at the bottom of the ignition switch.

Motogiro said:

Another obvious possibility might be the ignition switch it self of the wire feeding and coming from the ignition switch. If all the other possibilities check out start checking the wires in the steering area (Where they bend) and at the bottom of the ignition switch.

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Some of the mid 07, 08 FJRs had bad ignition switches, a wire wasn't soldiered correctly to one terminal.

They also had the wire loom to the ignition switch plastic tied way too tight causing intermediate electrical (full loss of power) problems...

One guy made up an emergency ignition loom/switch to carry should one fail on the road. Yamaha did do a re-call on both issues

FinalImpact said:

. . .
Does the clock loose time? If the answer is no, that confirms the ground to the POD is good and the backup fuse stayed connected to the battery. I think that is something but not much.

So, lets ask ourselves this; what has the means to turn off the engine, the dash pod, not leave an error code, and then spontaneously fix itself?

.... what "does work" when it turned itself off. Does anything at all work? Flashers, brake light, power to anything?

. . . lets go for the jugular like the ignition switch itself!!! Although its not something that usually takes siesta as you mention above, it or its wires and connections seem very likely as its not mis-behaving otherwise.
. . .

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I think someone mentioned that switch??? Maybe not :BLAA: but NO, CLIFF says it and wow!!! :Flip:

FinalImpact said:

I think someone mentioned that switch??? Maybe not :BLAA: but NO, CLIFF says it and wow!!! :Flip:

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That's cause Cliffs "da man!":BLAA:

FinalImpact said:

I think someone mentioned that switch??? Maybe not :BLAA: but NO, CLIFF says it and wow!!! :Flip:

Click to expand...

TownsendsFJR1300 said:

That's cause Cliffs "da man!":BLAA:

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Now wait a minute!?!?!?! Is it fixed Huh???

Motogiro said:

Now wait a minute!?!?!?! Is it fixed Huh???

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We're on the topic of God like powers, keep up already! :innocent:

:BLAA:


OK - back to the thread. . .

my speedo cluster blackouts happened today while riding. thankfully, the lights and engine did not cut out. in my case, it was a loose connection at the battery positive terminal. when i hooked up a relay/power supply, i tightened the battery bolt directly on the bare wire as a proof-of-concept. never got around to soldering a connector on there. :spank: i've since disconnected the wires until i get around to soldering a more permanent solution. btw, another symptom that pointed to the battery: the cluster, including backlight, would cut out completely when stopped at a light. upon resuming/revving, the cluster came back - leading me to think the revs weren't high enough to provide power to the cluster and the battery was not connected.

Re: Narcoleptic Electrical System Update

Thanks for the replies! Here's an update;

Went to the shop and talked to the mechanics yesterday. They've had the bike out several times and can't make it die. They've looked at some of the connections but didn't see anything unusual. They said everything looked 'immaculate'.

They did say that sometimes a battery can cause weird problems like a couple of these posts mention, but, when the problem first started and the motor was only cutting out momentarily, the lights and display stayed on and the clock wasn't affected so that puts some doubt on that. They said they were going to talk to their corporate masters this week and see if they had any opinion about a problem like this.

In the first post the symptoms included a total loss of power including dash/cluster light as if the entire bike was dead. Now the bike has power to the cluster but there is faiure? When this failure occurs does the starter spin the motor?