Crash aftermath summary - may help some of you

- July 7th '08: I got out of work on my FZ, and a car rushed out of a parking lot to my right, trying to make a left hand turn in front of me. I ended up hitting the front left panel of the Mercedes, flew in the air and landed 30-40 feet away on the other side. More details here: http://www.600riders.com/forum/fz6-general-discussion/6389-accident-last-night-v3-0-destroyed.html

- I did not answer any questions on the scene of the accident ("not sure officer, I can`t remember right now")

- I ended up at the hospital and luckily I didn`t have any broken bones or anything serious (just a badly broozed right shoulder)

- Would have been WAY worse without my gear (specifically leather jacket with shoulder kevlar pads + helmet). So wear your gear

- I got home late the same night, and called my lawyer first thing the next morning.

=> Do NOT call your insurance, do NOT call the cops, don`t do anything before you talk to your lawyer. This is important as anything you say may be used against you later on.

- My lawyer really took care of everything:
* recommended a chiropractor and made appointments for me,
* recommended a MRI facility and made appointments for me,
* dealt with my insurance and the other party's insurance to expedite the settlement,
* made sure to double check everything I had to sign to make sure I wasn`t getting screwed (and it saved me),
* gave me excellent advice about how to involve my own health insurance, to have them cover a LARGE chunk of the bills,
* negotiated all the medical bills to reduce them considerably (try to do that yourself and they`ll send you packing...),
* told me how to setup payment plans for all the medical/hospital/ambulance/doctor/etc.. bills, to avoid having delinquent bills that could have affected my credit score,
* + lots of misc stuff...

In other words, getting a lawyer in case of an accident involving another party is essential imho... I would have been screwed without one for sure.


Here is break down of the process (how it happened for me at least):

- the other party got a ticket on the scene of the accident for failure to yield traffic. There were also witnesses on the scene who talked to the cop, so the case was fairly straight forward, i.e. the other party was at fault.

- in this case, there are 2 main categories: property damage (your bike), and everything else (medical bills, lawyer bills, pain & suffering...). You may take care of the property damage ONLY (when you talk to the insurance companies, never say anything about the accident or anything related to it), since you know best what your bike was worth. Everything else is taken care of by your lawyer.

- In my case, I created an Excel spreadsheet, listing a fair market price for the bike (check local classified...), along with all my mods (including comments about whether I still had the receipts or if I paid cash for used parts), and the price of all my damaged gear (leather jacket, helmet...). I sent the spreadsheet to the other party's insurance (it is your choice whether you want your own insurance to cover these costs -and they'll get their money back later from the other insurance-, or the other party's insurance, I chose the other party's insurance as my own insurance would not cover the gear and a bunch of aftermarket parts... in other words, they were stupid and did not want to work with me). The other party's insurance on the other hand reviewed my list and offered a price without asking for any receipts... They offered $9k for property damage, which was basically what I was asking for.

- As mentioned above, my lawyer took over for everything else. Typically, in a case like that, the rule of thumb is that you add all your medical bills together, and multiply that number by 3 to get your final settlement amount. For example, if your medical bills are $10k, the total settlement paid by the other party should be $30k. Then, 1/3 of that money goes to pay the medical bills ($10k), 1/3 to your laywer ($10k) and the last third to you for pain and suffering ($10k).
This rule however depends on a few things, but mainly what insurance you and the other party have... my case was a little different, because:
1) the other party only had $15k max for liability
2) I did not have under-insured insurance (I do now though!!!)

In other words, we only had $15k to play with (property damage is not included in this and was paid out to me up front).
So again, we "only" had $15k in my case, so my lawyer had to be creative... basically, I had to call my health insurance, and have them issue payments to cover ALL the medical bills... they are obligated to do so, even though they would subsequently expect to get their money back from me... However, the trick here is that once my health insurance paid out, my lawyer contacted them and claimed that since I was not "made whole" after the accident, it was their responsibility to cover part of the bills.
From there, my health insurance exercised their status and relationship with the hospitals/doctors/etc... and the $20k+ bills I had were suddenly transformed to $15k... my health insurance actually ended up covering most of these, but I was left with around $5k-$6k of bills left over, which my lawyer negotiated down to $4.5k...

SO......... to summarize:

- I got $9k for my bike (way more than I actually put in my bike lol),
- out of the $16k liability coverage of the other party, 1/3 was for my laywer, i.e. $5333, $4500 went to pay the left of medical bills, and the rest is for me, i.e. $6200

Basically, thanks to my laywer, I got around $15k out of that accident. Without my laywer, I would have had about $23k of medical bills, and $16k to pay them...

Conclusion: if you are ever in an accident involving another party, get a lawyer!!!! You won`t regret it.

Good summary Wavex! I like the way you think, many people would not look at it that way and try to do it themselves and end up in the hole. Glad everything worked out and of course, you made it out alive.

Damn, did you buy your lawyer a beer? He did a good job.

That is good news.

It is also nice to hear (I am not a lawyer) that the Lawyer helped you get what you should have.

The point you make about not saying anything to the Cop is the best advice anyone can give. What ever the Cop writes down will be considered accurate, even if he got it wrong.

Whether at fault or not, what ever you say WILL be used AGAINST you. So just say I can't think right now I need to go to the hospital and make sure I'm OK.

This buys you time and alows you to get yourself legal advice you need.

When your in an accident it is everyone for themselves.

I'm gland things worked for you.

or at least a good bottle of wine or 2. Great write-up!!

Glad this has worked out for you, mostly that you were essentially OK. People tend to focus on the accident itself and forget about the financial aftermath, which can end up being a lot more painful.

Hang in there, and let's hope it remains Buell v 1.0, right?

I'll admit, I was a bit afraid to open this thread David...

Thanks for the info!

WOW...a very nice lawyer indeed. I would send some flowers or candy to them asap for all of this. But I never knew any of this stuff until just now. Thanks a lot for the awesome post, and thanks for a quick education also.

PS
Am glad you are OK. Keep on riding my friend. And I also like that Icon vest u bought. Matches your suit.:thumbup:

Sawblade said:

Damn, did you buy your lawyer a beer? He did a good job.

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Well, he did it because he knew he was going to score 1/3 of the settlement money no matter what happened heh... but yeah, they did a good job indeed.

ANLR21 said:

or
Hang in there, and let's hope it remains Buell v 1.0, right?

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let's hope..................

tom5796 said:

I'll admit, I was a bit afraid to open this thread David...

Thanks for the info!

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np Tom... did you get the t-shirt btw? where's my pic?

Damn I wish the guy that nailed me did not leave the scene, my medical bills were over 20 grand alone.

the dude has a benz and only has $15k liability? :spank:

As an insurance adjuster I can tell you that your aftermarket stuff isn't covered by the policy you purchased. It was covered under the other parties liability coverage because they are responsible for your damages whether it be your watch or your bike. Again, nothing to do with the insurance company.

Multiplying your medical bills x3 or any number for that matter is a common misconception and completely untrue.

Sorry to say but you would have gotten most if not all of everything you got without the lawyer. The lawyer just took 33%.

Now, a lawyer can help a lot of people that just aren't educated or otherwise in the know, but for most people, a lawyer isn't necessary.

I am glad to hear you were ok I just get tired of the misconceptions people spread about insurance companies.

YamahaMAXdRPMs said:

the dude has a benz and only has $15k liability? :spank:

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18yo asian chick... I assumed she was driving daddy's car...

Imperitas said:

As an insurance adjuster I can tell you that your aftermarket stuff isn't covered by the policy you purchased. It was covered under the other parties liability coverage because they are responsible for your damages whether it be your watch or your bike. Again, nothing to do with the insurance company.

Multiplying your medical bills x3 or any number for that matter is a common misconception and completely untrue.

Sorry to say but you would have gotten most if not all of everything you got without the lawyer. The lawyer just took 33%.

Now, a lawyer can help a lot of people that just aren't educated or otherwise in the know, but for most people, a lawyer isn't necessary.

I am glad to hear you were ok I just get tired of the misconceptions people spread about insurance companies.

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I am sorry, but most of your statements above are untrue in my case.

First, how do you know my aftermarket stuff wasn't covered by my insurance? how could you possibly know the insurance coverage I had at the time of my accident? please enlighten us
As a matter of fact I had a $2k aftermarket insurance coverage, but my insurance made sure they would not have to pay a dime for this... "sorry we do not cover your custom paint job"... "sorry we do not cover the mods you bought used"... "sorry we only cover the mods that directly are necessary for the vehicle to function properly"... "sorry, we do not cover your gear"... etc... I still asked them for a quote for just the bike, and they were lower than what State Farm offered for the bike! wtf? I pay them every month!!!

Then, another correction to your statement above is that State Farm did not use any of the $15k liability coverage to cover my property damage... it was a separate deal since I got $9k for the bike, AND $15k liability.

How can multiplying the med bills by 3X be completely untrue when it turned out to be true for me lol It is a "rule of thumb" that works in most cases...

lol... how would I have gotten most of it without a lawyer? did you read my first post? please re-read it... without a lawyer I would have been in deep **** with a check for $15k from State Farm and $23k of medical bills to my name... please explain how I would have gotten all of that resolved on my own.
Of course if you have lawyer "knowledge", which you may have, you could have done some of the stuff yourself, but in my case, there is no way, and I strongly believe that "most people" would have no clue about how to do stuff, and would have been ripped off by greedy insurance companies...
My own insurance tried to make me sign a paper that was closing the case on their end... my lawyer cought it on time and threatened to sue them... suddenly they were very cooperative... bastards!

Now State Farm (other party's insurance) was great... really great actually.

i have state farm too :innocent:


my agent actually lets me in on little loop holes to save me money. Like the loop hole of putting my bike in my wifes name... Now she has NO bike experience, she is like 5'3", and weighs roughly 115. She is 26. I am 24 and have the MSF course. Her yearly rate is <$400... mine would be >$1200... in english hers is like $389.. mine would have been $1,200+.. and i am 100% covered to ride this bike. its just in her name.. hmm would other insurance companies have givin up that info so easy?

Thanks for the great write up. This was very helpful!

My wife was hit in her car yesterday. She was driving her 3-month-old Honda Accord (which she saved for 8 years to buy!) She's royally pissed, but not injured. It's the first crash either of us have been involved in in a collective 40 years of driving.

So far, State Farm has been great. We live in a small town and the agent really is someone we've developed some trust with. I hope it's not a write-off, but there was a LOT of damage to her car.

If I were in your situation (an injury) I would DEFINITELY have called a lawyer too - nice insurance agent or not. Injuries are not something to mess around with and there are just too many stories out there of guys getting screwed. The insurance company is ultimately looking out for their own interests first, the hospital is looking out for theirs, but a lawyer is much more motivated to look out for your interests (his/her check is dependent on it). Like it or not, our system was designed to be adversarial. You can be polite about it, but at the end of the day it's a business decision and you have to be ready to fight. It's got little to do with someone's level of education either - you often pay a lawyer for what they MIGHT have to do and what they know, not just for what they actually end up doing to help. In your case, it sounds like your lawyer did a lot.

David, Did/do you have health insurance? Did they not cover your medical bills? The reason I ask is I have been in some bad accidents, in a wide variety to sports and simply paid my deductable/co-pay.

I think the approach you took was very wise to ensure you were compensated. I was rear ended and my car was totaled and I got totally hosed on my car by MY insurance Co. The driver had a license from on state, license plates from a second and insurance from a third. I looked at the cop and said, "WTF?". He didn't bat an eyelash and the guy who hit me was never heard from again. I only received $500 in pain and suffering and receive only $2,200 for a car that was worth about $4,500.

I thing you did the right thing and thank you for documenting what you did.

Wavex said:

I am sorry, but most of your statements above are untrue in my case.

First, how do you know my aftermarket stuff wasn't covered by my insurance? how could you possibly know the insurance coverage I had at the time of my accident? please enlighten us
As a matter of fact I had a $2k aftermarket insurance coverage, but my insurance made sure they would not have to pay a dime for this... \\"sorry we do not cover your custom paint job\\"... \\"sorry we do not cover the mods you bought used\\"... \\"sorry we only cover the mods that directly are necessary for the vehicle to function properly\\"... \\"sorry, we do not cover your gear\\"... etc... I still asked them for a quote for just the bike, and they were lower than what State Farm offered for the bike! wtf? I pay them every month!!!

Then, another correction to your statement above is that State Farm did not use any of the $15k liability coverage to cover my property damage... it was a separate deal since I got $9k for the bike, AND $15k liability.

How can multiplying the med bills by 3X be completely untrue when it turned out to be true for me lol It is a \\"rule of thumb\\" that works in most cases...

lol... how would I have gotten most of it without a lawyer? did you read my first post? please re-read it... without a lawyer I would have been in deep **** with a check for $15k from State Farm and $23k of medical bills to my name... please explain how I would have gotten all of that resolved on my own.
Of course if you have lawyer \\"knowledge\\", which you may have, you could have done some of the stuff yourself, but in my case, there is no way, and I strongly believe that \\"most people\\" would have no clue about how to do stuff, and would have been ripped off by greedy insurance companies...
My own insurance tried to make me sign a paper that was closing the case on their end... my lawyer cought it on time and threatened to sue them... suddenly they were very cooperative... bastards!

Now State Farm (other party's insurance) was great... really great actually.

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Your gear would not have been covered no matter what. Is your suit covered while driving a vehicle and you get into an accident that's your fault? No. Your policy covers the bike itself. If you purchased an aftermarket endorsement, I would need to read the language specifically to advise you on what would and wouldn't be covered. Did you provide documentation to support your mods like receipts?

The reason your property damage (motorcycle) was seperate was because it's a seperate coverage. Every hear 15/30/60 or 50/100/300 or something like that when talking about insurance. That's for injury 15k or 50k per person, 30k or 100k max if multiple people involved, and 60k or 300k property damage. Meaning your injury claim was handled under 15k coverage and your motocycle was handled under a completely seperate coverage for property damage. That's why you got 2 different checks because it's 2 different claims.

Your claim just so happened to work out by your x3 rule. But hey you're right. I just make my living settling insurance claims and have been for several years now.

The thing you and some people don't realize is that an insurance company will pay what they owe. It's much easier to do this than to pay to fight something in court and worse, the fines that the state's department of insurance will impose for not doing so.

I'm not trying to rain on your parade per se, I am just trying to tell the other side of the story. Again, most people don't need an attorney. Most go to the attorney when they think they are entitled to 100k and find out their only going to get 2k and can't accept it. That's the truth of the matter.

Hellgate said:

David, Did/do you have health insurance? Did they not cover your medical bills? The reason I ask is I have been in some bad accidents, in a wide variety to sports and simply paid my deductable/co-pay.

I think the approach you took was very wise to ensure you were compensated. I was rear ended and my car was totaled and I got totally hosed on my car by MY insurance Co. The driver had a license from on state, license plates from a second and insurance from a third. I looked at the cop and said, \"WTF?\". He didn't bat an eyelash and the guy who hit me was never heard from again. I only received $500 in pain and suffering and receive only $2,200 for a car that was worth about $4,500.

I thing you did the right thing and thank you for documenting what you did.

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As for your car being worth 4500 and got 2200. The insurance company paid what they felt the value of your vehicle was and had documentation to support it. People always think their vehicle is worth more than it is because it is, to them.