Test-driven: WRX, BRZ, Accord, Civic Si

Re: Test-driven: WRX, BRZ, Accord, Civic Si + GTI and Mazda3

beatle said:

Have you cross shopped the Mazdaspeed3? I don't like how it deals with torque steer (reduces boost for less fun in 1st and 2nd gear) but it should feel significantly less pedestrian than the standard Mazda3.

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Have not even considered it really.. as 2013 is last model year. I'm sure few are still out there, but my dealer didn't have any. Fuel eco is quite bad too on that one.. 18/25. Still.. would take one for a spin just to see what it's like.

Re: Test-driven: WRX, BRZ, Accord, Civic Si + GTI and Mazda3

iviyth0s said:

I still agree you should try the MS3 before you give the Mazda 3 a pass...I'd probably pick one up if my Saturn kicked the bucket...I test drove one and it has that raw mean attitude that you wouldn't expect from a 4 banger!

I'm surprised you like the Protege5 so much though, my sis has one and it put me to sleep all while getting sub-par mileage. I love wagons, that's why I was extra let down by it... It looks so sporty and quick but didn't deliver on any level for me (it is an auto though, so I guess if you have the manual version, that could be all it needs)

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Yeah.. mine's a 5-speed with short-throw-shifter. Makes a huge difference. I drove the auto version and found that boring too.

FinalImpact said:

The downside here is they put a cheap K04 turbo on them and most are need of replacement by 80 ~ 100,000 miles.

I found the 07 Mazda 3, 2.3 to be fun and sporty. Used to drive one for 3 years, but that vintage has a whole different look, different engine, and handles different than current production.

Currently driving a 06 Mazda 6, V6 3.0, 6spd TipTronic trans. It sticks in the corners well, rides firm with fairly aggressive damping control so on long rides it can be annoying but it really clings to the road. Even w/200 ft/lbs tq its more like the FZ with its happy spot 4k it comes on.

That said, I'll have to take a 2013/14 M3 for a spin and see if I get the same feeling. I liked the 07 - not sure about the new ones aside from the god awful smile....

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Yeah that's actually what kept me from purchasing one out of pure impulse (and some, at the time, unknown problems which I have since resolved on my Saturn now). I kept seeing "new turbo" , "factory replaced turbo"....that isn't as reassuring as seeing "new tires" or "fresh new oil" haha. I figured there was some kind of problem with longevity there, and I'm guessing there's no way around that huh? That would truthfully remove it from a potential next car, I don't buy into stupid reliability problems like that. Even for the fun.

I like my parent's 05 Mazda6 with the 3.0 V6 and 5spd...but the clutch is the worst I've ever driven (whereas the MS3's was wonderful). I wonder why they decided to give the newer ones 6spds . But I do like the steady pull that car has and the elegant touch it gives one when driving. Though I thought it felt a bit heavy on turns, like the tires were gripping well but the body wanted to blow away lol

When i was considering buying the 6 from them I lightly peaked around at some forums and actually saw your posts on one of them. I was like "small world" since I had just joined this forum not long before that

Erci said:

Yeah.. mine's a 5-speed with short-throw-shifter. Makes a huge difference. I drove the auto version and found that boring too.

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I figured and realized this was probably the case after typing up all that :spank:

Your reviews made me smile, your word count became progressively longer the more you liked the car. A pretty good barometer of how well each model grabbed you.
BRZ is a clear winner on paper. I can't wait to see how the Mazda holds up?

Nelly

Here comes the big downer.... only one of those cars is what I consider an "adult" car. I didn't used to care about that sort of thing but now that I'm in my 30's, the "kids" cars have lost some appeal. I'm not saying that you have to get a boring car but I know that I judge people based on their cars - it's my I sold my MR2's and my Jeep. "I" don't care what "I" drive but it's pretty hard for a professional to take you seriously when you show up in a rusty, jacked up Jeep or a 4cyl coupe with a turbo whistle (no matter how new).

Besides - toting kids is a lot easier in a larger sedan. We all end up with them eventually, one way or another.

Ford focus ST. Or a 2.0T genesis are viable options as well.

Nappa said:

What about the Mazdaspeed 3?
You get your Mazda 3 features with turbo and sport suspension.

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and bad torquesteer....

but the only speed3 you can have is the 1st generation. the new one is too small and besides the front end, looks wierd. and the last generation looked great but the front end was a total dealbreaker. it was like driving this ==>Blah down the road.

if you want something to be a fun car or a play car, it has to be RWD or AWD. any more than 200hp in a FWD car is useless, and you can still have fun in an underpowered RWD car.

i know this car is a little more expensive than your 25k mark but have you looked into the Acura TSX wagon. It has the same 201hp 4cyl as the civic Si, but it is exponentially nicer, it is much bigger, and best of all IT'S A WAGON. but the TSX that exists in the US is the same as the Accord that exists in the UK. even with the auto, its still decent fun to drive.

downsides: still FWD (not good for a big car), i think they only come in A/T, slightly above pricerange, Acura = slightly higher parts pricing

Nelly said:

Your reviews made me smile, your word count became progressively longer the more you liked the car. A pretty good barometer of how well each model grabbed you.
BRZ is a clear winner on paper. I can't wait to see how the Mazda holds up?

Nelly

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Looks like Mazdaspeed3 is not an option at all. They're gone. 2013 was last model year and there are none around me to try one.
Good observation about my *reviews* :thumbup: @ word count.

aclayonb said:

Here comes the big downer.... only one of those cars is what I consider an "adult" car. I didn't used to care about that sort of thing but now that I'm in my 30's, the "kids" cars have lost some appeal. I'm not saying that you have to get a boring car but I know that I judge people based on their cars - it's my I sold my MR2's and my Jeep. "I" don't care what "I" drive but it's pretty hard for a professional to take you seriously when you show up in a rusty, jacked up Jeep or a 4cyl coupe with a turbo whistle (no matter how new).

Besides - toting kids is a lot easier in a larger sedan. We all end up with them eventually, one way or another.

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Very valid points. However, I will never have kids (by choice) AND we have a SUV in addtion to whatever *fun* car I will end up with, so room is really not an issue.

I don't care too much about image and I don't think BRZ is too much of a kid car... a dropped Civic with Folgers can for exhaust tip.. that's another story :rof:

FZ09Bandit said:

Ford focus ST. Or a 2.0T genesis are viable options as well.

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I tried to test a the ST, but the dealer I went too was awful.. I walked out. I've read a bunch about that car though and honestly, if much of it is true, it turns me off. Too much electronic magic (torque vectoring) in a car I wouldn't necessarily trust to be very reliable. Still.. certainly worth a test-drive.
Genesis coupe.. also read and watched reviews. Supposedly the power is pretty good, BUT.. a lot of turbo lag, which I know I dislike a great deal. Once again though.. worth a test-drive.
So thanks for the ideas :thumbup:

SweaterDude said:

if you want something to be a fun car or a play car, it has to be RWD or AWD. any more than 200hp in a FWD car is useless, and you can still have fun in an underpowered RWD car.

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Big +1! Which is why BRZ was so much more fun to drive than everything else I tested.

AWD is great in some situations, but has to be done right to be fun. AWD with heavy front bias is not that much more fun to drive than FWD, from my experience.

SweaterDude said:

i know this car is a little more expensive than your 25k mark but have you looked into the Acura TSX wagon. It has the same 201hp 4cyl as the civic Si, but it is exponentially nicer, it is much bigger, and best of all IT'S A WAGON. but the TSX that exists in the US is the same as the Accord that exists in the UK. even with the auto, its still decent fun to drive.

downsides: still FWD (not good for a big car), i think they only come in A/T, slightly above pricerange, Acura = slightly higher parts pricing

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If it's auto-only, it can't be on my list. Manual trans is the #1 requirement. Thanks for the suggestion though :thumbup:

I think it would be easier for me to NOT have a car at all than to find a *perfect* one )

Maybe I'll get studded tires for my bike so I can ride it 365

Does the car have to be new?? Couldn't you get a very lightly used MS3 for a massive savings?

iviyth0s said:

Does the car have to be new?? Couldn't you get a very lightly used MS3 for a massive savings?

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Call me crazy, but I'm not too keen on buying a used MS3. What are the odds it wasn't abused?

Of course this could be said for just about any sport bike.. but I don't intend to keep any bike for 10 years.

No chance of finding a 3 year old MS3 with 2k miles on it in new shape.. unlike so many bikes out there

8823mi for 25K: 2013 MAZDASPEED3 MAZDA SPEED 3 6SPD TURBO CHARGED ONLY 8000 MILES

8391mi for 23.5K: 2013 Mazda MAZDASPEED3 for Sale in Johnstown, Pennsylvania - $23,490 with 8,391 miles JM1BL1L49D1835941 at Automotive.com

Still pretty low mileage, I'd test drive one closer to your first and see if it's what you want

Let me preface this with "I know I'm old, but"

The last car I bought in the UK, before I came to the US, was a 1984 Golf GTI with a 1.8L 8V engine. It was what they called there the Mk II. It was gunmetal grey with P-Slot allows and P600 tyres.

It wasn't the fastest car in it's class, the best handling car in its class or even the prettiest car in its class, but it did everything very very well. I chickened out long before it ever did.

When I bought it, 3rd hand with 56k miles on it, I was a member of the Aberdeen and District Motor Club. I ran it (HARD) for 3 years and sold it to a friend (also a member of the ADMC) who did the same thing until it hit just north of 200K.

Back in early 2002, when Enron gave me an enforced vacation, I test drove a VR6 version as well as a 2.0T version. Given my choice today I'd go with the dual clutch version.

To be honest it reminds me a lot of the FZ6. You can tootle around town if you choose to, but if you hold onto the revs a little longer it goes like hell.

I would have another in a heartbeat and when I no longer need something with 4 doors to haul the family around I will have another.

texcollect said:

Let me preface this with "I know I'm old, but"

The last car I bought in the UK, before I came to the US, was a 1984 Golf GTI with a 1.8L 8V engine. It was what they called there the Mk II. It was gunmetal grey with P-Slot allows and P600 tyres.

It wasn't the fastest car in it's class, the best handling car in its class or even the prettiest car in its class, but it did everything very very well. I chickened out long before it ever did.

When I bought it, 3rd hand with 56k miles on it, I was a member of the Aberdeen and District Motor Club. I ran it (HARD) for 3 years and sold it to a friend (also a member of the ADMC) who did the same thing until it hit just north of 200K.

Back in early 2002, when Enron gave me an enforced vacation, I test drove a VR6 version as well as a 2.0T version. Given my choice today I'd go with the dual clutch version.

To be honest it reminds me a lot of the FZ6. You can tootle around town if you choose to, but if you hold onto the revs a little longer it goes like hell.

I would have another in a heartbeat and when I no longer need something with 4 doors to haul the family around I will have another.

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Good stuff, man! I can see falling in love with GTI and definitely see how it can be compared to FZ6. Comfortable and forgiving, with an option to open it up and let it sing. Looking forward to checking out MKVII in July.

Erci said:

I will never have kids (by choice)

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Heard that way too many times to believe it from anyone not already sterilized. Being in the military, I get exposed to a lot of people who have no interest in kids but an unhealthy interest in sexual escapades. There's always kids in the future of anyone able to have them.

Good luck with that.

aclayonb said:

Heard that way too many times to believe it from anyone not already sterilized. Being in the military, I get exposed to a lot of people who have no interest in kids but an unhealthy interest in sexual escapades. There's always kids in the future of anyone able to have them.

Good luck with that.

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Fair point and I agree that this is likely true, for many of those who say "never". However, I'm 39 and have been married for a loong time. My spouse and I agree on this.. no kids. Pretty safe for me to get a sports car